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That was my first reaction too. If SmogWagen is using such a pernicious anti-metric to gauge progress I expect the results to be about as safe as their emissions control systems were green.
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies.
-- Sarah Hoyt
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Sander Rossel wrote: Who the hell measures productivity or success by LOC? 
IBM did. And it was a great success (for Microsoft).
Oh sanctissimi Wilhelmus, Theodorus, et Fredericus!
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and the emissions will be negative.
modified 20-Oct-19 21:02pm.
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"Turn light at the right", says the car!
Oops, that is only if you take physical control of the driving!  
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If the questions asked at Nvidia's forums are any indication, they do not have a prevalence of qualified programmers.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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Linkage : Microsoft buys Express Logic, adds a third operating system to its IoT range | Ars Technica[^]
This will give them another OS for IoT devices. ThreadX is a very lightweight, real time OS so this could be very useful. That is, depending on how it is made available to users and corporations. It will be interesting to see how this works out.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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ThreadX is very lightweight. CE was pretty lightweight as well and a very good embedded OS. Microsoft didn't care and won't care now.
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CE might have been appropriate for IoT devices but I think they scuttled it before the market for IoT stuff really took off.
As for ThreadX, they wasted a lot of money if they really don't care. I hope they see it for what it really is. What I mean by that is it's main focus is being very lightweight so shoe-horning .net into it would be entirely absurd. They need to get C and C++ to work on it and keep it ultra minimalist.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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Rick York wrote: They need to get C and C++ to work on it and keep it ultra minimalist.
Agree!
I often find myself wondering even about RPi. I own one and messed around with it.
It seems overkill for most embedded type of stuff and it is seriously minimal compared to a lot of IoT stuff, maybe comparable to windows ce and PocketPC.
But it's too large for IoT stuff. With IoT you just want some discrete component that runs on its own and does something very simple. These things like RPi are entire OSes seems too large for IoT to me.
For IoT they should be thinking extremely small like Arduino.
Just straight-up C based programs that can do a lot but is very minimal. Yes, I know that the Arduino IDE and associated language isn't quite just C but I think you know what I mean.
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Basing my comments on previous experience. In reality, the CE kernel is still IoT capable. Instead of buying ThreadX, why not just make CE royalty free?
I do agree with the idea of making it "ultra minimalist"; one problem CE had is they kept stacking crap on top of it (and .NET Compact had some serious flaws. Another problem is they were behind on driver support. The biggest problem is that Microsoft refused to support it in any meaningful way. For non-trivial issues, they'd send you to an overpriced reseller, most of whom were utterly clueless and useless. Then there was the licensing...)
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Well, I have read a few other things about this deal and Microsoft's intentions. It appears they are going to integrate Azure into ThreadX so it will soon be losing that "lightweight" character and minimalism I was hoping for. I can't say that I am surprised.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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https://upperedge.com/oracle/using-java-heres-how-oracles-new-2019-java-se-licensing-affects-you/[^]
After 1.8 Build 201, Java is no longer free for commercial use. Got an app that runs on Java? Your customers will be paying Oracle a MONTHLY licensing fee, per seat, to run your app.
Think about that. At 10,000 seats, that's a $1.50 each (fewer machines is more expensive.) So, $15,000 a month to run an app or $180,000/year.
Oh, and they're stepping up their auditing of Java use.
With .NET now multi-platform, maturing, AND FREE, how does this move make any sense?
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Each time I see development stats, it looks like Java is slipping. Add to that the vast use it currently has, and the inability of most industries to quickly replace an entire software architecture already in place... and Oracle is able to milk it for quite a lot.
Some devs refuse to change and will be a driving force in their company to keep using Java, this money is just overhead if there is a large development group that would have to be retrained/replaced to get off Java.
This will affect Oracle long term (beyond my productive lifetime), but I see it as a huge short term gain.
However, if I was a Java dev, I would be highly upset.
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Yeah, that crossed our minds. Where I'm at, our Java bill is going to be ... rather steep, every year.
Redevelopment costs of the in-house apps are a one-time charge and can start to be recouped in Java license fee savings after an average of five years of development and deployment. Some apps sooner, some a bit later.
We've got some 3rd-party apps that are Java dependent. Those vendors are going to take a large hit. If they haven't started redevelopment... well, we all know how that ends.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, this applies to the newer Java releases or also to the projects that use old runtimes?
Because we know how it will go...
GCS d--(d+) s-/++ a C++++ U+++ P- L+@ E-- W++ N+ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t+ 5? X R+++ tv-- b+(+++) DI+++ D++ G e++ h--- r+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
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I think Version 8 Update 201 is the last free version for commercial use. Update 211 and up now falls under the new licensing scheme.
Developer and personal use is still free.
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Wow. I have a few former customers, one known by a TLA, who are major users of Java for their manufacturing control systems. It's a perfect fit for them because they have about six or seven different platforms they support with essentially the same apps. I doubt they will be updating anytime soon.
It seems that Oracle considers generating additional revenue to be a higher priority than keeping users up to date with the software or even the future of the language. Oh well.
"They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"
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Yay! The death of Java! ![Jig | [Dance]](https://codeproject.global.ssl.fastly.net/script/Forums/Images/jig.gif)
Latest Article - A 4-Stack rPI Cluster with WiFi-Ethernet Bridging
Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny
Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
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Marc Clifton wrote: Yay! The death of Java! [Dance]
But I suppose it won't take javascript with... 
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Oracle's has a penchant for buying products, charging royalties, offering poor support, and pretty much killing said product. MySQL devs better beware.
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Dave Kreskowiak wrote: Your customers will [...]
Forgive me but could it be like this: The "Java-license" is the developer license, not the end user JVM license?
A lot of other languages, e.g. Scala, produce JVM bytecode. And if it was every JVM executable then not a single Android app on the planet would be free. I see no mention of JVM nor Android in the text. I do see "commercial users" though.
I do agree it still kinda sucks, but does not appear to be on an elephanting end-user magnitude.
"If we don't change direction, we'll end up where we're going"
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Nope. From the Java download page:
Quote: The new Oracle Technology Network License Agreement for Oracle Java SE is substantially different from prior Oracle Java licenses. The new license permits certain uses, such as personal use and development use, at no cost -- but other uses authorized under prior Oracle Java licenses may no longer be available. Please review the terms carefully before downloading and using this product. An FAQ is available here.
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Java SE is AFAIK the development environment. Not the compiled products. And phone apps are for personal use. I don't quite see how the quote disagrees with what I said.
Or did you mean enterprise apps?
"If we don't change direction, we'll end up where we're going"
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