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Stefan_Lang wrote: QT might very well suffer the same fate. At least the fate of being targeted
more frequently...
Absolutely no doubt about it.
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It's funny that everyone "hung in there" with windows, even through all the patches and getting hacked, until finally they have a decent product (windows 8)... but most people I hear from these days are just ready to bail on Java.
I used to program in java almost exclusively. I really like the language. But, that was before Mono. Now I program in c# most of the time.
I just find humor in seeing long term windows users bashing Java.
If it moves, compile it
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I was thinking the same thing, although if one had said, "After so many hacks, why won't Windows just go away", there probably would have been a lot more sentiment defending Windows.
I think Java's probably easier to like the less GUI work you do with it, but that might be my own bias  .
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Well, I do write this on my Mac, so not everyone "hung in there". However, I do think it is a sign that Oracle needs to do what Microsoft did over a decade ago: pause and do a complete security sweep. I don't see them doing it though, but that might just be my Oracle-hate typing.
--------------
TTFN - Kent
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The corporation I work for (nearly a $Billion/year in Revenue) bases their entire product line on the Java platform. If corporations that size are dependent on it I don't think it's going anywhere. That it is under attack as a platform is no surprise, is it? The Windows platform is constantly under attack because it is still #1 in the market. (I'm not including the mobile market). Tomatoes get thrown at the most visible players in any market.
I don't write Java myself (I'm a .Net developer) so, obviously, I prefer that platform for development. Oracle is just going to have to stay on top of the situation and everybody is going to have to roll with the punches, that's all.
Declaring the platform "obsolete" or "dead" is ridiculous. The pundits love to do that anytime something goes wrong with something. Just ignore it. Java isn't going to "go away", the platform is here to stay, just as .Net is. Prognosticating on why "X is DEAD" is a waste of time. Maybe it would be better to prognosticate on what can be done to fix it, instead of declaring it dead, perhaps? There are many people making a living based on that technology that the author of this silly article wants to "go away".
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The trouble is what do we mean by Java.
Do we mean Java on the Brower? Yep, it's a problem. They've been finding all sorts of hacks for it and it needs work.
Java WebStart / Auto-Update? Problems, but less so.
Java on the Server? Unlikely to go anywhere. .NET is still (imho, Mono not-withstanding), primarily a Windows-Only VM. It won't run on a Unix/Linux box.
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If we're talking about in the browser, aren't we talking about Javascript as opposed to Java? It's my understanding that the're really two different animals.
I'm not concerned that .Net doesn't run on Linux. At-least for desktop applications, Linux doesn't matter.
-CB
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Nope. Java used to run in the browser as applets or (occassionally) as a signed application.
When they're talking about disabling Java, they're primarily talking about disabling on the Client (ie: browser).
Javascript is an entirely different Beast (ECMAScript) and it's not going anywhere.
--
And I agree that Linux is irrelevant on the Desktop. It's presence is on the Server and Mobile.
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Oh yeah, right ... applets. Gotcha.
Thanks.
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Long before these latest major security holes, the common use of java applets (the main problem) did go away (mostly I believe it died out very early in java's life, after the novelty wore off). Unfortunately, installing java also still installs the plugin by default in most cases (just in case someone has an applet I guess). Remove/disable/never install the browser plugin and things are generally no less secure than using native OS applications. In reality it is still more secure, since a java application (not applet) itself isn't as vulnerable to common native issues, like buffer overflows (baring flawed implementations in a _specific_ VM code base -- i.e. Sun/Oracle JVM security holes vs some clean-room JVM implementation).
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I think this is the perfect answer to those problems, and to probably 99.9% of the complaints about Java. Definitely agree.
Yes, when was the last time I saw a (useful) Java applet that wasn't someone's thesis project?
--------------
TTFN - Kent
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Java won't go away, I believe it's important to differentiate the language from the runtime from the browser plugin from everything else. The language it's good, the runtime it's good, the problem is the browser plugin, you don't just ditch something because it's slightly bent, you try to fix it and if it's not possible and you decide it's not worth the problem then you walk away.
Honestly I believe there is no alternative to the main strength of Java that is Write once, Run everywhere, the closest contendant it's probably C# with the .NET Framework using the Mono runtime, but it's far from the mark set by Java.
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Hopefully the language will be replaced (over time) with Clojure or Scala. No need to throw the JVM away.
$0.02
Q. Hey man! have you sorted out the finite soup machine?
A. Why yes, it's celery or tomato.
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The "Java hacks" are not hacks of Java as a language or even of Java as a platform. They only concern sandboxing of Java applications in a browser - that is the Java plugin.
So if you use Java (as 99.99% of Java programmers and users do) as a server-side language, or to deliver Android or other mobile apps, build desktop apps, or cross-compile to other languages, the security problems of the plugin are completely irrelevant. No reason for Java to go away.
Note that other platforms mentioned (like QT... which is hardly even comparable) are "safer" only because they don't offer such sandboxing at all.
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North Korea will soon allow foreigners to tweet, Skype and surf the Internet from their cellphones, iPads and other mobile devices in its second relaxation of controls on communications in recent weeks. However, North Korean citizens will not have access to the mobile Internet service to be offered by provider Koryolink within the next week.
![Rose | [Rose]](https://codeproject.global.ssl.fastly.net/script/Forums/Images/rose.gif) for North Koreans.
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There's a script replacing LOL with "For Our Most Glorious Leader", but other than that, your connection will be totally private and secure.
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You mean they allow foreigners into the country?
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If they survive the fire wall.
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Yes, for a couple of years they have a ministry of tourism.
They pick you up at the airport and put you in a bus to drag you through the whole country. In the end they put on a show that makes the London Olympic opening ceremony look like a lecture about European ant species.
Vice has made a great documentary out of it[^]
.
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Compute with 0 instructions on Intel! Discover the awesomeness of the Intel MMU! Follow @julianbangert and @sergeybratus for updates. See a demo here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSRcvrVs5ug
What is this?
This is a proof by construction that the Intel MMU's fault handling mechanism is Turing complete. We have constructed an assembler that translates 'Move, Branch if Zero, Decrement' instructions to C source that sets up various processor control tables. After this code has executed, the CPU computes by attempting to fault without ever executing a single instruction. Optionally, the assembler can also generate X86 instructions that will display variables in the VGA frame buffer and will cause control to be transferred between the native (display) instructions and 'weird machine' trap instructions
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, waging all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies.
-- Sarah Hoyt
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Interesting read of the pdf, and kudos to them for reading the Intel docs.
But these sort of tricks are as old as the hills and no cpu is immune from interrupt vector misuse. Though I fear that similar multicore tricks plus paravirtualization features (ring -1) stuff is ripe for exploitation.
Q. Hey man! have you sorted out the finite soup machine?
A. Why yes, it's celery or tomato.
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As we build applications for more and more platforms, it is extremely important that we maximize our code reuse across platforms. With the release of Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8, Microsoft has made significant improvements in platform convergence – this convergence will continue with each release. They share the same core as Windows, and Microsoft removed .NET compact framework and replaced it with CoreCLR and added WinRT. Much of this is common to Windows 8 itself. However, it is important to understand that these are still two distinct platforms and still do not have 100% convergence with binary compatibility. Maximizing reuse across these platforms is key to an efficient development experience. PCL and MVVM for SOLID XAML.
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Sample Browser 1.0 for Windows 8 is released in the Windows Store today – a new relaxing way for Developers to search, browse, learn and share over 5000 code samples on any Windows 8 devices, including Surfaces! This is a collaborative effort from Microsoft All-In-One Code Framework, Windows 8 Content Publishing Team and MSDN Samples Gallery. Gesture-enabled sample code galleries for your tablet... but do you code on your tablet?
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ASP.NET Health Monitoring was one of the big features I worked on for the ASP.NET 2.0 release. It was going to be the solution for troubleshooting and supporting ASP.NET apps in production … it also was one of the most misunderstood and arguably most over-engineered features we built. Fast forward 8 years later, after releasing ASP.NET, IIS7, and building LeanSentry. This is the story of this feature, lessons learned while building it, and a practical take on when to use/not to use Health Monitoring for monitoring your ASP.NET applications. What happens when your health monitoring system needs a health monitoring system.
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Clever way of advertising for LeanSentry. Though it does look pretty fantastic... I'll have to see if I can get that setup in our production Azure environment.
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