|
interesting read thru the responses. Codewitch. I agree with you. I would not work for Elon. He abuses people. There was a job 5+ years ago at Space-X. I was checking it out. I figured I was more than good enough to do the job. But the more I read one line in the job description the more I didn't want to work there. "You will be required to work extra hours in order to hit deadlines" Seriously, Ummm hard pass.
I agree with the people who said Twitter's work ethic before Musk was horrible. True, but a hard swing the other way is not going to help either.
I honestly think people (myself for sure) need something to do. They need a job. IT is part of being a balanced human being. But 30 to 40 is plenty of hours to work each week. The rest should be spent being good to those around you and to yourself.
To err is human to really elephant it up you need a computer
|
|
|
|
|
I think it is pretty common for people like Elon to look for employees who want to throw 100% of themselves into their careers. I've avoided those sorts of environments but have no issues with CEOs/Employees who enjoy those types of working environments.
I prefer low pressure work @ 40hrs. per week.
I make less money, but spend less on self-medication. 
|
|
|
|
|
Assuming I would have taken a job at Twitter to begin with (I wouldn't have), I too would be out the door in a hurry.
Musk's theory of operation is the antithesis to my beliefs and management theory. Also, I wouldn't last long if I stayed as I don't play the sycophant role very well.
|
|
|
|
|
I would in a heart beat. This is why. You don't get to be the richest person in the world without doing things right. Musk is a workhorse. He worked over a 100 hrs a week to get Tesla off the ground. Everybody doubted him. If you look at the great entrepreneurs in History, they persevered. Edison failed 3000 times before he got the light bulb right. Working for people like this is the best education. I learned so much about business from working at Walmart - the #1 retailer, far more than any teacher who has only read in books and not "done" what they teach. There is so much to grow as a human being by persevering through the tough parts. you learn to handle emotions in a much better way. Those that can - do. Those that can't - complain and switch jobs.
|
|
|
|
|
Arguably he piggybacked off of someone else's work and took all the credit. I'm not saying he's not an engineer. But he was born 3 inches from homebase and bragging about his triple.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
You are right, Musk is a workhorse and his success is astonishing. And if you choose to, you can work as hard as he does.
But here is the problem... If you put in the time and somehow manage to deliver that widget for him by the deadline, you will get a pat on the back (not from Elon, your manager maybe) and a gift card. And then you get a new unrealistic deadline. Then, Musk's net worth balloons by a billion dollars.
No matter how hard you work, how much you sacrifice, how much profit you create for the company, you will never be as successful as Elon Musk as long as you are working for Elon Musk.
"I'm doing it for the opportunity to be promoted," you say.
Granted, but we're never going to get there. Not in that meat-grinder kind of environment. The narcissists will get promoted over you. The sociopaths and psychopaths will end up as the directors and VP's. But not us. We're the horses doing all the work, kind of like George Orwell's Animal Farm.
Been there, done that. It was a solid six months before I had returned to something vaguely resembling sanity. It took me that long to be able to look back and understand how much I had been caught up in that hunger games mentality.
I am grateful to say that I currently work for a man that appreciates the work his employees do and we are rewarded accordingly. And we aren't working crazy hours with boneheaded deadlines. I think I'll stay here.
|
|
|
|
|
Member 11685282 wrote: I would in a heart beat....I learned so much about business from working at Walmart
When I was single, young and had no experience.
Now I know what I am doing.
I also know what other people are doing.
I do my job, not theirs.
And I never pay with my life (those extra hours) to fix their problems. Especially since I always tell them before hand that those problems are going to show up.
Now if they want to pay me for it then I am all for it. But it must be actual equal pay. Nothing like 'an extra day off after 3 months of 60+ hour work weeks'. So written notice that I get exact number of vacation hours added (vacation hours must be paid if I leave the company for any reason.) Or even better a bigger paycheck and more stock options.
|
|
|
|
|
No, but not because of Elon. I wouldn't have worked there before, either. A plague on humanity.
|
|
|
|
|
A day in the life of a Twitter dev:
If you chose to go to the office today...
Arrive at 8 am
Go to the gym for a workout
Head to the meditation room to relax
Take a shower and change into something comfortable
Head to the cafeteria to get some breakfast
Get some Starbucks and go to the roof to enjoy it on the patio
Ponder why Twitter needs 5 times as many devs as any other company for the same work
Now its about time for lunch...
Elon is expecting devs to "work" at the office for 8 hours a day. How outrageous!
|
|
|
|
|
|
That's just people projecting because they are in a panic that their woke paradise might be brought back to reality.
|
|
|
|
|
Are you saying businessinsider is fabricating the story? because they say they've got their hands on internal emails to that effect.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
I'm not really saying anything, I don't have any facts. But IMHO, I don't think that is coming from Elon. That's probably management freaking out and trying to be proactive.
I once had a VP ask way so and so wasn't at their desk. This resulted in managers demanding that no one leave their desks for any reason. If you had to talk to someone 2 desks over, you had to call them. We had people written up for going to the bathroom. None of this was directed by the VP, they just asked an innocent question.
So I would reserve judgement until things settle down, management begins to breath again, and Elon has more than a couple days on the job.
|
|
|
|
|
Well, given Musk's public statements on the issue about firing most of his employees and the like, I'm not inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.
But even if I was, I won't put up with being treated that way in a workplace. By anyone.
I know I'm not alone in that, which is why I suspect Twitter is bleeding top shelf talent right now.
If I was a recruiter I'd have been outside their HQ weeks ago.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
you might be right, but I read somewhere that fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
It does, and has certainly favored him, but that doesn't necessarily translate to the betterment of the people under him. 
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
Yes!
Can imagine having a boss that have thought and creates at your same level?
Not bound by the normal corporate BS?
Not every idea becomes a project and not every project pans out, but when your boss is up at night thinking of what to come up with next, instead of how to please everyone else.
Howard Hughes was like that, and because he was unimpeded by the public corporate bounds, his companies were used to run very large important projects.
Look up the Glomar Explorer.
I would love to be part of projects like what Elon Musk and Howard Hughes have created.
|
|
|
|
|
No. I don't do twitter and it's unlikely they'd be making products that require embedded code. I don't write Windows/Linux code (except for scripts, mostly to support my embedded coding). I'm pretty sure I wouldn't fit in there very well anyways since I'm the kind of guy that would tell a woman that "Yes, that dress makes you look fat" when she asks.
|
|
|
|
|
No, but I wouldn't have worked there pre-Musk either. All of that garbage is worse than making dirty bombs in a basement lab for a dictator.
|
|
|
|
|
i assume you talk about the programmers at twitter
"My guess is his top talent has already fled"
what exactly do you mean when you say top talent from the pool of twitter programmers?
Jonathan Blow on Software Quality at the CSUA GM2
at the beginning of 2016: twitter had close to 4000 employees, space_x had 450 and they build and lunch rockets into space
ps - i'm not saying that i'm better than the twitter programmers, but i'm definitely not in the space_x league
|
|
|
|
|
I mean the people that can deliver projects on time and on budget, who write great code.
They exist in small groups at most any major institution, even Twitter. Talent is as diversified as it is rare.
It's kind of weird to compare employee count of two wildly different organizations that do completely different things. I don't really get that.
To err is human. Fortune favors the monsters.
|
|
|
|
|
ok, it is now clear what are you saying by top talent.
to me, working as a programmer in a company like twitter would be considered only if i want to work as less as i can without getting expelled. sort of like, be invisible in the huge number of developers that have a job of taking care of the functionality of twitter. because i'm sure, from what i see, that twitter can be maintained by 8 competent and 2 high class developers. and those competent developers are in no way skilled like the guys who made Doom or Quake or who won the 4th place at the Assembly Demo Competition or the Apollo 11 team working under Margaret Hamilton. at any point past 2014 twitter had hundreds of developers.
don't underestimate "working undetected", because sometimes that is exactly what i want. sometimes, i need a 2-3 years break to study: lisp, tcl, perl, forth, assembly for vga under ms-dos or simply enjoy reading novels while i am at work. because, you cannot get a job that will improve your lisp/forth skills. you can only get a job that can improve your: JavaScript, C#, Java, C++, php... skills
|
|
|
|
|
I would only work there now that Elon bought it.
Twitter is well known to censor political & corporate opposition which is the definition of fascism. Elon buying it & actively being against censorship of even his own critics is a huge positive.
|
|
|
|
|
Hmm. Let's t'ink 'bout dis t'ing.
Previous massahs sold their loyal, trusting, staff to the ... <badum> Balrog? Check.
Previous massahs got big fat golden parachutes and billions in stock for themselves and didn't give a hoot-n-holler about what happens to their loyal, trusting, diverse staff that worked so hard? Check.
Loyal, trusting, staff are whining and pining for the good old days slaving under dem dere massahs dat sold dem down de river? Check.
Balrog is clueless about the most basic aspects of running this kind of business? Check. Oh, dear lordy lordy. Balrog is beyond clueless. Balrog actually thinks subscription model is viable. So, that's a check, check, check, check, check, checkity, check-check!
Oh, snortlefeathers! You've talked me into it! Just like dem good ol' dayz down south.
Kin ah sell you me liver? Just one, and it's healthy.
Balrogs need helpers.
|
|
|
|
|
Honestly, if I were fresh out of school, or at least 20 yrs younger.
Why Not?
I College Friend has a son who works for Tesla loading the AI Data.
He started fresh out of college, loves it.
An even closer friend has a son working for SpaceX (This kid was Fully Java Certified at 11,
full-ride scholarships to about every school he applied to).
Both love their jobs and feel they have learned half a careers worth.
If you are a Dilbert Fan... You won't find a Wally floating around.
The team itself would likely kill them, and cook them on a spit out back!
So, it's not for the feint of heart.
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
