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ed welch wrote: MS stopped supporting c++ with VS.NET
I wish they stopped shipping the c++ compiler with Visual Studio, and developped a separate IDE for system programmers. VS became too big, fat and slow.
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Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: VS became too big, fat and slow.
Agreed.
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I wish I could vote this a 500, but alas. Agreed 10000%. What we _really_ need is the kind of IDE that VS6.0 had - not an all-in-one thing, but separate IDE's. I really dont _care_ that I can now compile a project solution written in a million languages, one project for each. First, no reason to do that..like, ever. Second, what's the problem with compiling them in separate IDEs and linking the libraries?
Anyway, 5'd this.
"thats a pretty strong & powerful API they've got there...in fact, so strong, that it wont allow itself to be a tool...it wont allow anyone to use it"
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Anton Afanasyev wrote: what's the problem with compiling them in separate IDEs and linking the libraries?
In fact this is the point, Microsoft is going toward making all programmers as users, no one has to understand what is happening under the hood, so any new student or programmer will have the vs express just clicking the wizards writing a line of code and blah you got an application .
This is bad, ask any programmer knowing only C# or VB (I don't mean the folks who upgraded from C++ of course) about linking, loader, or any other low-level concepts, he will know nothing in fact.
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It seems as i'm the first one that votes for IBM.As a developer IBM do good job by leading Eclipse project.
You see the news , Eclipse community did something that Microsoft or Google can not do, released a whole Europe package in time.
Yeaa , this is not only work of guys in IBM , but when you see the chair man list , you'll IBM is dominant, simply it's the initiator of ECLIPSE ecosystem.
IBM is also known with it's other software's that is not "maybe" visible to end user but used in many infrastructure.
[AGP]
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Their continuing development of the Lotus Notes abortion completely eliminates any credit they deserve for anything else.
Some sins may not be forgiven.
Software Zen: delete this;
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Gary Wheeler wrote: Their continuing development of the Lotus Notes abortion completely eliminates any credit they deserve for anything else.
And don't forget Rational - that's almost worse than Lotus.
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Which company did most damage to devs around the world in areas of :
brain, bloat, instability, security, bad design, tech that sheep adore, dumb protocols, and more..
No doubt the one that will get the most votes.
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I second you on that. These surveys make no sense.
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User of Users Group wrote: Which company did most damage to devs around the world in areas of :
brain, bloat, instability, security, bad design, tech that sheep adore, dumb protocols, and more..
No doubt the one that will get the most votes.
No doubt indeed - Sun.
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Of course Microsoft but for database I think Oracle,But I have a question Where's SAP AG[^] on this list?
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Even though I develop on an Apple product I don't use any of Apple's development tools. I do however benefit from the terminal on Mac OS X as well as the built-in Ruby support. Plus I don't like Apple's restrictive practices. Paying for a certificate to list my iPhone app on their store is horrid.
I chose Mozilla and Amazon as I use their tools each and everyday and they make a positive difference. Firebug, brilliant tool, rests on Mozilla tech.
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote: At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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It's the good-est. 
- S
50 cups of coffee and you know it's on!
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Poll is shooting up Microsoft.
What about the story of Bill Gates stole the Apple Lisa GUI 
So its Apple or Microsoft?
"Silence will create respect and dignity; justice and fair play will bring more friends;
benevolence and charity will enhance prestige and position; courtesy will draw benevolence;
service of mankind will secure leadership and good words will overcome powerful enemies"
Ali (Peace be upon him)
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And where did Jobs got the idea... Maybe we should add -- Xerox 
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Yup, from the Xerox Parc Alto which had every element in modern computing including early work on a laser printer. Other than refinements the computer has not evolved in any fundamental way from the original Alto released in 1973.
"The pursuit of excellence is less profitable than the pursuit of bigness, but it can be more satisfying."
- David Ogilvy
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John C wrote: Xerox Parc Alto
Did you mean Xerox Palo Alto Research Center (PARC)?
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No I meant what I said (with more punctuation): Xerox P.A.R.C. "Alto" branded computer.
"The pursuit of excellence is less profitable than the pursuit of bigness, but it can be more satisfying."
- David Ogilvy
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John C wrote: the Xerox Parc Alto which had every element in modern computing
I beg to differ. The Alto didn't have a blue screen. Credit for that goes to Microsoft.
/ravi
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Well it did have a debug stack trace that would popup when it crashed so perhaps more advanced.
"The pursuit of excellence is less profitable than the pursuit of bigness, but it can be more satisfying."
- David Ogilvy
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Was just typing, "maybe we should ask Xerox". Glad I looked at the replies first
The only thing unpredictable about me is just how predictable I'm going to be.
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Except from saying that also Apple has used ideas from other companies (see the comments of others in this thread), you should note one thing about industry in general and especially about computer industry: There is no creation from zero!
Everyone uses ideas based on other ideas, improves them, then someone else uses these new ideas for his own projects and so on...Who or which company can actually say that it has evolved from nothing to where it stands now without even thinking of what the competition is doing? The power of a company lies in its ability to innovate and develop new ideas and products, thus adding value to the value already existing in the IT industry. Does Google started from scratch, inventing WWW and TCP/IP again? No. Does Apple started from scratch re-inventing GUI of Xerox? No.
Microsoft innovates in ways no other company does. And what is more, it uses all of its resources so that it can not only innovate itself, but also give the opportunity to developes innovate themselfs. You can download any API, Visual Studio Express, MSDN help, etc etc etc for free and develop. Try that on other companies...
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Palavos wrote: you should note one thing about industry in general and especially about computer industry: There is no creation from zero!
We are all standing on the shoulders of giants (to quote Sir Isaac Newton)
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Palavos wrote: Microsoft innovates in ways no other company does
Yes. Partially agreed . This is not always true. For instance, Microsoft was reluctant to introduce tabbed browsing support to the IE. But when Mozilla really innovated the Firefox, Microsoft forced to follow the suite. Have a look at
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/technology/2008/05/firefox_can_browsers_make_buck.html[^]
Another trend among giants like Microsoft and Google is, if they can't make it they will buy it!!!
Google took youtute.
Microsoft tried to swallow Yahoo!
"Silence will create respect and dignity; justice and fair play will bring more friends;
benevolence and charity will enhance prestige and position; courtesy will draw benevolence;
service of mankind will secure leadership and good words will overcome powerful enemies"
Ali (Peace be upon him)
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Nisamudheen wrote: But when Mozilla really innovated the Firefox, Microsoft forced to follow the suite
Correct. Except that Firefox in turn copied from Opera.
Look. It doesn't really matter who copied from whom. What matters is who has the best implementation at any point in time. For me, with browsers it's Firefox. Despite the fact that my intro to tabbed browsing was with Opera the pioneer.
Kevin
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