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Do we really need to be referred to articles that contain phrases such as "badass motherfucking sorcerer-hacker wizard-god" or "interviews in the Valley have truly gotten f***ing awful"? [I didn't star out "uck", it was done by the Lounge input editor!]
I was in the US Coast Guard. We didn't hesitate to use coarse language amongst ourselves. But its use was with other Coast Guardsmen, not the general public.
I doubt strongly that articles containing this language would be published in any reputable publication: in a peer reviewed publication or in a newspaper or in a book. I also doubt that these phrases could be used in a business meeting without reprimand.
I'm in no way a prude. But this is use of foul language was for shock purposes only. It added nothing to the value of the article. As a matter of fact, I stopped reading when I came across the phrases.
I find the Code Project Insider useful in that it presents me with articles that are useful. Mostly, I read for entertainment. Sometimes for their newsworthiness. But if this trend continues, I fear that I will cancel my subscription to the Code Project Insider and read more carefully the BBC articles on Tech and Science.
Gus Gustafson
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I'd suggest that this should be raised in Sugs.n.Bugs[^] - Chris can look and reprimand / comment as necessary.
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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Done, thanks for the suggestion.
Gus Gustafson
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I'd raise this in the Sugs and Bugs forum. I do agree with you on this, but the sugs/bugs forum is the place to let the powers that be know of your discontent.
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Done, thanks for the suggestion.
Gus Gustafson
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Are you referring to the article where Kent's comment said, "Caution: uses strong language"?
Was that not sufficient warning that the linked article might contain strong language?
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined."
- Homer
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Yes.
However it is not so much an issue that a warning was given; rather the issue is that a warning was needed.
Gus Gustafson
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That sounds more like a problem with the author of the article than a problem with Code Project.
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined."
- Homer
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Come on! The author apparently believes that his language was acceptable for its shock value.
The Daily Insider needs to remember its readers' sensibilities and honor them to a much greater extent.
Dissemination was a decision by Code Project, not the author.
Gus Gustafson
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gggustafson wrote: The Daily Insider needs to remember its readers' sensibilities and honor them to a much greater extent.
But those would be your sensibilities, wouldn't they?
Or have you conducted a survey of all 11.5 million members to ask each of us what we find offensive?
If your intention is that there should never be an article linked from the newsletter which might possibly offend any of the members who see it, then we'll end up with a completely empty newsletter! When you're dealing with a global community, absolutely everything could be considered offensive to someone.
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined."
- Homer
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He didn't say he speaks for all the users. He has a right to voice a complaint based upon his own individual sensibilities.
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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Which is partly my point: "... needs to remember its readers' sensibilities and honor them to a much greater extent" actually translates to, "... needs to remember MY sensibilities and honor them to a much greater extent".
He has a right to voice a complaint, but not to suggest that his complaint represents the sensibilities of all readers of the newsletter. 
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined."
- Homer
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gggustafson wrote: rather the issue is that a warning was needed.
I don't understand: would you rather have had no issue and been surprised? This is, for me a non-complaint; if you see an article with a warning and you feel your sensibilities might be offended, don't read it.
I would agree, of course, that, for the most part, swearing adds no value. Until it does. I'll decide that for myself and not have you as my unpaid and very unwanted censor.
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Too bad you flamed out!
Gus Gustafson
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On the one hand I could agree with you, CP should not be promoting, in the main, non-KSS material, but, and we're talking a friggin big BUT, the content [sans foul language] is worth while reading. The author is addressing a real problem in interviewers who don't ask anything close to appropriate questions.
tuppence added.
veni bibi saltavi
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I'm not sure that I agree. The interview process does need repair. The major problem, as I see it, is that interviews are aimed in the wrong direction. The candidate should be interviewing the interviewer, not the other way around.
I'll give an example. Many years ago I needed a web savvy individual who could participate in the development of a US Army web site; a site that was to be used by Generals and senior Colonels to determine the Army budget for the future out-years. We cast the net in the Norfolk area and a number of candidates arrived at our front door. I reviewed each resume carefully and during the interview asked some simple questions about the candidate's experience. I then launched into a fairly complete description of the project. At the end, I asked three questions: Are you interested? Can you contribute? Do you have any questions?
I hired the individual who I believed performed best in describing his earlier experience and who answered "yes" to all three questions.
Gus Gustafson
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Soooo, putting that language in a lounge post, with no warning is OK? 
"the debugger doesn't tell me anything because this code compiles just fine" - random QA comment
"Facebook is where you tell lies to your friends. Twitter is where you tell the truth to strangers." - chriselst
"I don't drink any more... then again, I don't drink any less." - Mike Mullikins uncle
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Point taken, and apologies.
I had hoped that the warning would be enough. I felt that despite the language, it was a useful article to read. I'm sorry that was not the case.
TTFN - Kent
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May I suggest that KSS be the rule?
By the way, good job!!
Gus Gustafson
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You haven't met my kid sister 
OKdOK, I'll try to keep it cleaner in the future, and thank you for the kind words.
TTFN - Kent
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Hi Kent, I see no reason for you to apologize.
People who are not mature enough to understand a clear warning about "strong language," who make a choice to go and read the material with the warning, and then feel they have a right to be offended ... because of the language ...
Are not mature enough to to have their opinions listened to, particularly on the Lounge.
cheers, Bill
«I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center» Kurt Vonnegut.
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I found the article an interesting read, so I'm glad you included it, as I wouldn't have found or read it otherwise.
I understand, however, that some (especially the US?) are a bit more sensitive to such language. Yet, the last time I talked to an American (and also a Canadian) basically every second word was a swear word, so I don't really get why you'd be so sensitive when it comes to the media (tv, internet, radio) but use the words while speaking to someone else.
And I think an article with foul language is currently quite an exception in the insider news (at least I wouldn't have noticed a trend towards such articles). In my opinion it's probably fine as long as the content itself is worth mentioning and interesting to read and they aren't included every day.
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gggustafson wrote: But this is use of foul language was for shock purposes only.
Most headlines are 
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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gggustafson wrote: But this is use of foul language was for shock purposes only. It added nothing to the value of the article.
Probably quite a bit of every technical article in every discipline has a non-trivial amount of content that adds nothing to the technical content. I used to read Byte magazine long ago and specifically for the Pournelle column specifically because it wandered all over the place on non-technical issues.
I wouldn't be surprised if the majority, probably almost 100% of 'popular' technical authors are popular because of the non-technical content as well.
Consequently it is condemnation of the type of content and not whether it is apt. And that really goes back to common current culture.
gggustafson wrote: But if this trend continues,
Guaranteed that culture will change. If you reject it then it can very well leave you cutoff from a great deal of society. Which might be ok with you, but I rather like hanging out with those younger than me, so I am certainly not going to reject them because of changing mores in speech.
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