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Uuuh, that sounds too much like 'intelligent design' to me....
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Breeding would be a form of 'intelligent design'. The fact that people did it (not a God) makes one doubt that it could be 'intelligent' mayhaps.. that's why I said guided.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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Mel Padden wrote: So life didn't give us lemons
On the other hand, it did give us bacon, so there's that. 
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"When life gives you lemons",
Buy some bacon instead. 
"This new learning amazes me, Sir Bedivere. Explain to me again how sheep's bladders may be employed to prevent earthquakes"
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Mel Padden wrote: When life gives you lemons
Make lemon party.
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Can't unsee that.
DURA LEX, SED LEX
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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I'm reviewing a third-party system next week. I notice that they use BizTalk for their most of their middleware requirements but it's not something that I've had any involvement with.
If anyone has worked with it, how would you rate it on a scale of "complete PITA" to "couldn't live without it?"
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All I can say is, good luck!
[TBH, my only experience is negative but it may be as much down to the implementation rather than the product itself].
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I'm hoping it was the implementation in question but "BizTalk" is certainly not a word that I hear as often as I used to.
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Quote: would you rate it on a scale of "complete PITA" to "couldn't live without it?"
The endpoints are not opposites, wives and girlfriends are perfectly able to stand on both extremes...
DURA LEX, SED LEX
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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We had to use it for a project that had a high volume of data moving around. We looked into doing it ourselves and found it way too complicated to learn in a short amount of time. We hired a consultant and he was not cheap. If you can become very good at BizTalk then you'll likely have a very well paying job for a long time to come.
On other smaller projects we used other products that allow you to point to 2 systems and drag and drop field relationships and were quite easy to use. As I recall, this was years ago, BizTalk was a lot of code just to do the small things because it gives you so much fine control over the process.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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My experience is with BizTalk 2006.
As someone here said, it gives you very fine control over the process - approvals, routing, you name it. That is the good side.
The bad side is that the development tools were a PITA to work with. This may have improved in later editions.
My takeaway - very powerful, but the tools could use improvement.
If you have an important point to make, don't try to be subtle or clever. Use a pile driver. Hit the point once. Then come back and hit it again. Then hit it a third time - a tremendous whack.
--Winston Churchill
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Thanks both.
It certainly looks like there have been a fair few changes in the 2010 and 2013 versions but whether or not they change the general experience, I don't know.
I suppose ease of use and fine-tuneability are always going to be the big trade-off with this kind of package and what may be a godsend for one task might well be a complete burden for the next. I would hope that the tools would have undergone a fair bit of improvement (not that I know for sure that the supplier isn't still using 2006).
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My only experience is a decade old but we chucked it out as it was too slow transforming the volumes we were trying to push through.
It was almost certainly caused by the developers, complete lack of knowledge of the product and short time frame.
the 3rd party also used XML as the transport format - for multi millions of records.
Built as CSV parser and chewed through the transforms using stored procs.
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity
RAH
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We are talking about 0) FarceBookers and 1) The Daily Fail ... 
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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2 seconds straight.
EDIT: I discoverd that Daily Mail is visible from my workplace. It is really a special journal.
DURA LEX, SED LEX
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
modified 14-Oct-16 6:24am.
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It's certainly handy if you run out of bog roll or want something for the guinea pig to defecate on.
This space for rent
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The Evening Standard is cheaper at that.
DURA LEX, SED LEX
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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Yeah - but that comes with the defecation already performed... 
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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You have a point...
DURA LEX, SED LEX
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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Good thing you are not using your real name here. Linking to Daily Mail could have seriously affected the quality of your life, otherwise! 
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Sorry, the Mail is classic reading! Its is like a comic, and its free! 
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