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GeneralRe: This is not the right venue but... Pin
Forogar7-Nov-12 3:52
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glennPattonWork7-Nov-12 3:57
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Manfred R. Bihy7-Nov-12 4:12
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GeneralRe: This is not the right venue but... Pin
glennPattonWork7-Nov-12 4:42
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GeneralSpam Mail Pin
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Peter_in_27807-Nov-12 14:33
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GeneralBest question ever Pin
jim lahey7-Nov-12 2:24
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GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
CDP18027-Nov-12 2:37
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GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
Member 85751217-Nov-12 3:51
memberMember 85751217-Nov-12 3:51 
You make it sound as if you will never, ever, accept any sort of critisism of your favorite programming language...

First: Any programming language can be (ab)used to write really obfuscated code. Some programmer subcultures tend to write unreadable code, whatever language is used, but if that is PHP, it leads other people to associate unreadable code with that language. Furthermore, if most subcultures (ab)use the language that way, the few programmers that use it properly might not be strong enough to save the reputation of the language.

Second: If you don't know/understand the "philosophy" of a language (or of whatever) - the rationale for the mechanisms offered, the inteded usage pattern - then it always looks messy. To the guy who understands the reasoning behind the design, and is trained in the same thought patterns as the programmer of the obfuscated code, the code is not at all obfuscated. Nine out of ten times claims of "obfuscation", "unreadable" or "messy" code (or coding style) really says "I am lacking the background to understand why it is done that way".

Surely, some philosophies are easier to grasp than others, and some rather elegant programming languages failed in the marketplace because its protagonists were mostly programmers rather than teachers (of the philosophy of the language). Some languages excel in clean and simple basic mechanisms but rely on the programmer to handle any sort of abstractions, which some programmers do better than others. (Everyone understands that we need higher basic abstractions than Turing machine marks, but many lisp programmers don't understand that we need higher basic abstractions than car and cdr.) And then, some languages offer mechanisms that is an open invitation to obfuscation. My favorite example is Fortran 'return k': A function can take (numeric) labels as arguments. 'return 4' means: Do not return to the statement following the function call, but to the label supplied as the 4th argument. More recent languages provide several comparable mechanisms, such as switch fallthrough and address-of-operators that might have null effect, but none as grave as 'return k'.

I have worked some, but not much, with PHP. It will never become my favorite language, but I would never agree than you can't write well structured, readable code in PHP. I don't think obfuscated code is a bigger problem with PHP than with, say, classical C.
GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
GenJerDan7-Nov-12 3:57
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GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
Pete O'Hanlon7-Nov-12 2:58
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GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson7-Nov-12 3:10
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GeneralRe: Best question ever PinPopular
Dalek Dave7-Nov-12 3:26
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GeneralRe: Best question ever Pin
Pete O'Hanlon7-Nov-12 3:58
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JokeRe: Best question ever Pin
Marc A. Brown7-Nov-12 3:39
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GeneralI hate fixing computers PinPopular
OriginalGriff7-Nov-12 2:22
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
jim lahey7-Nov-12 2:26
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Bert Mitton7-Nov-12 6:22
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
jim lahey7-Nov-12 6:26
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Tom Lint7-Nov-12 22:58
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
jim lahey7-Nov-12 23:04
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
alexander ypema8-Nov-12 1:59
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Dan Neely8-Nov-12 2:38
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
S Houghtelin7-Nov-12 2:43
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OriginalGriff7-Nov-12 3:32
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
S Houghtelin7-Nov-12 4:03
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Wayne Gaylard7-Nov-12 5:18
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Dan Neely8-Nov-12 2:41
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Colin Mullikin7-Nov-12 4:12
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Reelix8-Nov-12 12:18
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
OriginalGriff8-Nov-12 21:17
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Nueman7-Nov-12 3:37
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
Steve Burchett15-Nov-12 5:52
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Chris Quinn7-Nov-12 3:50
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
OriginalGriff7-Nov-12 3:56
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
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GeneralRe: I hate fixing computers Pin
RaisKazi7-Nov-12 5:15
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GeneralRight Transplant PinPopular
ChrisElston7-Nov-12 0:28
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Nagy Vilmos7-Nov-12 0:32
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ChrisElston7-Nov-12 0:35
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CBadger7-Nov-12 0:45
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