The Lounge - CodeProject

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

Nelek2-Dec-14 21:57

2-Dec-14 21:57

Maybe he saw the Matrix and now is having nightmares

Jokes apart:
I kinda agree with him. If machines get to really think and have self-conciousness... I don't know what will be after that, but I think it won't be nice.

M.D.V.

If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

User 101325462-Dec-14 22:03

User 10132546

2-Dec-14 22:03

Oh well, we've had a good run. Worse things happen at sea and all that.. Sleepy | :zzz:

How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.

modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

User 592412-Dec-14 23:52

User 59241

2-Dec-14 23:52

We're there already. Smartphones are in control and humans are simply drones. The amazing thing is how they allow their human host to think they are the controlling intelligence.

Peter Wasser

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

ZurdoDev3-Dec-14 1:25

ZurdoDev

3-Dec-14 1:25

There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

newton.saber3-Dec-14 3:30

newton.saber

3-Dec-14 3:30

pwasser wrote:
Smartphones are in control and humans are simply drones.

So true. Most people cannot drive a car without their smartphone.
...Let's see, just got a text. Need to check it but I will probably drive over the old woman crossing the street, if I do so. Well, no matter, must check text!!!!

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

Rage3-Dec-14 0:48

Rage

3-Dec-14 0:48

I don't think you need to think in terms of 'Rise of the Robots'. If you rise the level of AI or computation to one where a lot of things would be almost certainly predictable (weather, sports event, etc...), then it will maybe not be the end of Humanity, but life would certainly be more bitter.

~RaGE();

I think words like 'destiny' are a way of trying to find order where none exists. - Christian Graus
Entropy isn't what it used to.

Re: Stephen Hawking warns of the end of Humanity

Slacker0073-Dec-14 1:59

Slacker007

3-Dec-14 1:59

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2014/12/02/stephen-hawking-wants-to-play-bond-villain/[^]

BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 9:57

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 9:57

I'm curious if there are any BASIC programmers around here?
I have an old BASIC structure that I'm curious about what it is doing.
This is from a piece of code that is 30 years old, last month.

10 READ T$ 
20 C=ASC(SEG$(T$,1,1))-64
30 N=ASC(SEG$(T$,2,1))-C
40 Y=N-26*(N<32)
5000 DATA THINBCHA

REM #### LINE 10  read DATA into T$ (THINBCHA)
REM #### LINE 20 get the first char stored in T$ (as a byte) and subtract 64 from that value, 
REM #### (cont') store value in var C
REM #### LINE 30 get 2nd char stored in T$, subtract value of C and store in N
REM #### LINE 40 Okay, what is the value of Y? 

REM #### The part I'm confused about is what does (N<32) do? I thought it was a bit shift, but why would it be 32 bits when I believe a byte on these old machines (APPLE II, TI-99) would've been only 8 bits max?

REM ### HINT: This code is doing some kind of XOR data encryption / decryption on those bytes, so that the final value of THINBCHA should be some valid English word after you convert the bits.

I just can't understand what that operation 26*(N<32)
It kind of makes you think it would be 26*(BOOLEAN) such as 26*(1) or 26*(0), but if that were true then I'm not sure why the dev didn't just do *1 or *0, so I don't think that is what it was doing.

Has anyone seen BASIC code like this?
It's just an interesting puzzle to me. I was able to figure out all the other things, like
1. weird data read syntax READ T$ just reads that data in
2. odd function called SEG$()
But this one I can't look up, because N<32 means something quite different when involved with an if statement.

Is anyone interested in this old puzzle?

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

R. Giskard Reventlov2-Dec-14 10:09

R. Giskard Reventlov

2-Dec-14 10:09

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:29

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:29

UPVOTE!
Funny thing is, that if I calculate that formula just so, then the answer IS 42!!!
Big Grin | :-D

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

Dave Kreskowiak2-Dec-14 10:10

Dave Kreskowiak

2-Dec-14 10:10

newton.saber wrote:
40 Y=N-26*(N<32)

Hint: Usually, on old versions of BASIC: False = 0, True = -1

It's not a bit shift operation. It really is comparing N to the value 32.

A guide to posting questions on CodeProject

Click this: Asking questions is a skill.
Seriously, do it.

Dave Kreskowiak

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:18

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:18

Oh -1, ahhhh... let me see how that works in my formula.
I've actually re-written the code as a C# algorithm to see if I can crack the code.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:40

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:40

Holy crap, I just altered the code to use the -1 instead of 1 for true and this has helped me decrypt more of the data.
This is amazing.
I will show more about this as I post back to this main thread.

Your single point that true = -1 on old systems really put me over the top on this code.
This is a silly 30 year old program but it is the first program I ever attempted to write -- copied from a magazine and tried to program it into my Coleco Adam[^] and it failed.

So, you're helping me solve a bug I've considered for 30 years. Big Grin | :-D

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

DaveX862-Dec-14 10:14

DaveX86

2-Dec-14 10:14

SYNTAX ERROR Smile | :)

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

DaveAuld2-Dec-14 10:14

DaveAuld

2-Dec-14 10:14

I suspect that the N<32 is checking to see if that N is a non readable character. i.e. space = 32 and everything lower in the ASCII tables is non-readable.

Dave
Find Me On:Web|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn
Folding Stats: Team CodeProject

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

ozTechnocrat2-Dec-14 10:18

ozTechnocrat

2-Dec-14 10:18

VAX VMS BASIC Smile | :)

SEG$ is the same as mid$

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:19

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:19

Thanks for adding to the conversation. Smile | :)

It's amazing that there are people out here that have seen this old stuff before.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

Slacker0072-Dec-14 10:19

Slacker007

2-Dec-14 10:19

doesn't N get assigned a value in line 30?

so let's say N == 5. 5 - 26 if (5 < 32) ??

just guessing.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:31

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:31

Right you are.
And with what you've said and what another commenter said (about true = -1 -- not 1 like I thought) I believe it is possible that what the dev was trying to do is just insure that the byte value was not a negative value -- by multiplying any value which is negative by -1 to get a positive number.

Thanks for your input.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

Jeremy Falcon2-Dec-14 10:49

Jeremy Falcon

2-Dec-14 10:49

newton.saber wrote:
1. weird data read syntax READ T$ just reads that data in

In BASIC, putting a dollar sign at the end of a variable was shorthand for ensuring the variable is a string.

newton.saber wrote:
2. odd function called SEG$()

It's just a substring type function. Also, ASC() converts a character to its numerical equivalent, such as A to 65.

newton.saber wrote:
But this one I can't look up, because N<32 means something quite different when involved with an if statement.

BASIC doesn't have a bit-wise operator like that. It's doing a less than comparison operation.

Jeremy Falcon

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 10:58

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 10:58

Great information. Thanks very much for reading and giving me some more clues.
I really appreciate your time.
Thanks to everyone's help and clues, I've cracked the code / "encryption" and I'm going to post another entry in this thread explaining where this all came from.
Thanks again.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter2-Dec-14 10:50

Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter

2-Dec-14 10:50

You may play with this here:
http://calormen.com/jsbasic/[^]

(N<32) will return 1 (true) or 0 (false)
64 is the @ char, and 26 is the number of Latin letters...
Also remember that T$ can contain only characters you can input from keyboard (printable ones)...
An ASCII table for reference: http://www.asciitable.com/[^]

Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

Jeremy Falcon2-Dec-14 10:52

Jeremy Falcon

2-Dec-14 10:52

That's cool. Thumbs Up | :thumbsup:

Jeremy Falcon

Re: BASIC Puzzle (Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instructional Code)

newton.saber2-Dec-14 11:00

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 11:00

Thanks very much for reading my crazy little thread and replying with helpful insights.
I really appreciate it.
Because of everyone posting, I've cracked it and I will post an answer at the bottom of this thread. Thanks again.

Re: BASIC Puzzle FINAL ANSWER

newton.saber2-Dec-14 11:29

newton.saber

2-Dec-14 11:29

I know this is long, but it took me 30 years to figure this code out. Big Grin | :-D

Seriously.

Thanks To All
First of all, thanks to everyone who contributed information.
Everyone got me looking at the odd code (N<32) and thinking about it differently.
The big trick was that old BASIC considers -1 (negative 1) to be value for TRUE.
That was the KEY to solving this.

Coleco Adam
The code is from a program found in a magazine (Family Computing) from November 1984. I was but a lad then and owned my first computer a Coleco Adam[^]. I didn't know anything but tried to type this program in and it never worked.

Flash Forward to Now
30 Years later I did a google for Lapis Lazuli Coleco Adam and someone has archived the magazine online. CRAZY!!! I guess I've just always thought of this because it was my first programming experience.

You can see it here:
THe Case of the Missing Lapis Lazuli[^]
I just had to know the answer to the Mystery. Why didn't it work? And what were the real words that the data represented?

Old BASIC Code
I started examining the code and the first thing I found out was that the TI-99 code was the nicest so I used it to try to crack the code.
If you want to just see the code listing look at this page of the article (left page)[^]:

Cracked The Code- Rewritten In C#

If you have the great LINQPad C# TOOL[^] you can copy my final code below and run it and see the data is cracked.

The original data looks like:

4000 DATA 3,THINBCHA,BURGEKCN,TUVI0N,4,CMKHUH*V 
4010 DATA KABGUVAT,SYBLAR,6HIVBA,S,HLBH4ER,KHLDETYR 
4020 DATA NHCIF,NHWAS,KHTES,5,PIXUHBESA,FNUfiSKY 
4030 DATA HJBHYQA4G,SUX,CHADPLQLeJ,1 ,HPYBPX,1 ,DAEXGL 
4040 DATA 1 ,8YTKUVYCVEJ,1 ,C5=7<1 ,1 ,HZVEEBE,1S 
4050 DATA DGSVVI6X):,AQIPUP,J=,LIME,GAHRLU,IRW,SMAX 
4060 DATA dqhvvsv2,fznk,satgwl,hba,kesp,twfiwe,h-ij:h 
4070 DATA CUHYHUVHG1,4,HERSYRPG,LAZ,TNBY,I8LNWN7

There's an interesting part of the algorithm which reads the integer from the data, determines that is the number of words that it should read, then it reads the next N data items as words.
You can see all of this in the code at the previous link.

Here's the final C# code just to decrypt the data.

void Main()
{
	string [] allStrings = { "THINBCHA","BURGEKCN","TUVION",
			"CWKHUH*V","MABGUVAT","SYBLAR","GHIVBA",
			"MLBH4ER","KHLDETYR","NMCIF","NHWAS","KHTES",
			"PIXUHBESA","FNURSKY","MJBHYQA4G","SUX","CHADPLQLQJ",
			"MPYBPX",
			"DAEXGL",
			"BYTKUVYCVEJ",
			"C5=7<1",
			"MZVEEBE",
			"DGSVVIGX%","AQIPUP","J=","LIME","GAHRLU","IRW","SMAX","DQMVVSV2","FZNK","SATGWL","MBA","KESP","TWFIWE","HIZM","CUHYHUVHG1",
			"MERSYRPG","LAZ","TNBY","IBLNWN7" };
	
	foreach (string strIn in allStrings)
	{
		byte encryptor = (byte)(Convert.ToByte(strIn[0]) - 64);
		// Console.WriteLine("encryptor value: {0} ", encryptor); // used in XOR
		string outWord = string.Empty;
		int elseCounter = 0;
		for(int x=1; x<strIn.Length;x++)
		{
			byte outByte = (byte)(Convert.ToByte(strIn[x]) - encryptor);
			// Console.Write(string.Format("{0} ", outByte));
			if ((outByte + encryptor) >= 65)
			{
				if (outByte < 65)
				{
					outWord += Convert.ToChar((byte)((outByte-26*-1)));
				}
				else
				{
					outWord += Convert.ToChar((byte)((outByte)));
					
				}
			}
			else
			{
				
				//outWord += Convert.ToChar((byte)((outByte+-11*33*(outByte^encryptor))));
				elseCounter++;
				if (outByte < 32)
				{
					outWord += Convert.ToChar((byte)((outByte-33*-1)));
				}
				else
				{
					outWord += Convert.ToChar((byte)((outByte)));
				}

				outWord += Convert.ToChar(outByte);
			}
		}
		// Console.WriteLine("**** STAGE 2 *****");
		Console.WriteLine(outWord);
		//Console.WriteLine();
		//Console.WriteLine("elseCounter : {0}", elseCounter);
		//Console.WriteLine();
		//Console.WriteLine();
	}
}

After that I can figure out the answer to the puzzle. Even though it is in weird order and there are still a couple of scrambled ones--- due to my mistyping or something.

Lapis Lazuli Puzzle ANSWER SPOILER ALERT!!!!
NOTHING
SPECIAL
ABOUT
THERE''S
NOTHING
FISHY
ABOUT
YOU''RE
WASTING
YOUR
TIME
WITH
SHERLOCK
HOLMES
WOULDN''T
BE
EXAMINING
CLOCK
WATCH
WRISTWATCH
22::4499..
MIRROR
CORRECT!!
PHOTO
33
WAS
TAKEN
IN
THE
MIRROR..
THE
HANDS
ON
THE
CLOCK
ARE
REVERSED..
REFLECT
ON
THE
SCENE..

modified 2-Dec-14 17:50pm.

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