|
|
Thank you!
That looks very interesting, I'll pass this to my friend...
|
|
|
|
|
Well it all depends on how your "friend" writes a contract with the client.
There is a standard price/contract for the regular work/development etc and then you put a new addition in the contract for the transfer of the technical knowhow (except patent) to a group of people in the client side and they take care of technical support from pre-defined time.
cheers,
Super
------------------------------------------
Too much of good is bad,mix some evil in it
|
|
|
|
|
One way some people deal with this, from a legal point of view, is by having the source code held in escrow[^].
This means that if anything ever happens to you, your the source code can be released to the customer so that they can then hire another developer to refactor using the source code held in escrow.
In terms of how you convince the customer - if the customer believes you are the best option and at the same times is scared about everything depending on you - there is very little you can say as they have set their own dilemma up by understanding you to be the best. Code escrow may be the way to go.
Good luck with convincing them 
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
|
|
|
|
|
What I know as an option is to encrypt all the source code using a very big password giving the customer the custody of that source code (big set of files) and then, storing that password in a neutral place (which earns money by stored paper pages) that the customer can reach prior demonstrating the program maker has been late for x hours to provide them an answer...
That was more or less what my friend offered but it is still not enough for the company...
Thank you for the post and the wishes!
|
|
|
|
|
Carry a weapon. Fear and respect are the result. Trust is merely a happy accident.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
modified 30-Mar-16 10:46am.
|
|
|
|
|
Trust happens only while they are alive... 
|
|
|
|
|
Joan Murt wrote: What do you do in those situations in order to relieve the customer and to show them they can trust you?
My 2c:
- Give them access to the source code (or as someone else pointed out, use some sort of escrow mechanism)
- Ensure them that all documentation for building and supporting the system will be provided, this includes things like domain registration, server keys, etc.
- As you go through the process, document tech support questions and answers, so they have a growing library of "how to..."
- Possibly provide a couple other devs that you know and trust that can help to take over the project if something happens to you. Of course, in your case, your expertise will make this difficult.
- So, to the point, in your case, finding experts with the tech they are needing will always be difficult, and it should be pointed out that even a "company" will probably not have that particular mix of expertise.
- Which means that they need you both need to do a risk assessment, clearly identify the risks, and come up with how to mitigate it, especially since #5 means they are really going to have to look hard to replace you. They're stuck in that situation anyways, even if they get cold feet.
Marc
|
|
|
|
|
So... my friend is dead as he won't be able to work for anyone... 
Yes, the idea is to grow up a company that offer industrial software solutions, but at the beginning it is not possible to have plenty of people working there...
Let's see how it goes...
Thank you for your feedback!
|
|
|
|
|
1-3: Source code and well organized documentation was what I was going to suggest. A wiki is good for that.
4-6: In the documentation, you can indicate which skills are needed. In your list of devs, you can indicate which skills they have. It is not necessary for one person to have all the skills required.
|
|
|
|
|
I'm going to play a slight bit of devil's advocate here, but aren't they right to be concerned? He might have time to support them now, but what about after he has taken on 10 other clients and they all need support too? What I would do is tell them that you'll draw up a service-level agreement (SLA) that outlines the level of support they will get and (most important for the client) penalties for failure to deliver that level of service. This could range from the issue being non-chargeable or even financial penalties. This still might not be enough as if your friend can't afford to maintain the SLA and there is no real value in suing they're still lacking their service.
As for escrows and encrypting the code etc, it is normal that if you do a job for someone they own the code, not you, so no need for any of that to be considered. If your friend wants to keep the code too then they're going to have a hard time convincing anyone to do work with them.
|
|
|
|
|
Yes, they are right to be concerned, but working with a big company is neither a guarantee that nothing will go wrong (i.e. Windows updates ).
Working in the industrial sector is a little bit different than working in the IT industry, and usually the code is owned by who makes it, but you are right, this could be a future problem.
Thank you for posting.
|
|
|
|
|
You
A: work for them so property source cope is theirs
B: sell them product for one time price
Company will abuse "support" to harass you for free features durvtonevolving needs
|
|
|
|
|
A and B) Not always in the industrial sector.
When I get software from my providers they usually license the software for one CPU and you have to buy that again and again as you want to install it in different machines...
The technical support fees need to be specified.
the best technical support is the one that is not needed, but a very good technical support is that one that solves the issues as soon as possible... for a price.
|
|
|
|
|
This is not the answer you want, but I would never trust a major technological investment to a sole proprietor business no matter how technically competent or dedicated the person is. What happens to the investment if the person gets ill or worse, dies? What happens if something goes wrong while he is on vacation?
Life happens to all of us, and doing a major investment in a product that only one person knows anything about and potentially losing that investment and having to start over when something happens to that person is just not smart business.
Within you lies the power for good - Use it!
|
|
|
|
|
Of course this answer is perfectly reasonable. Being the answer my friend wants or not... 
That should be covered by allowing access to their source code if it's demonstrated that my friend can't give them proper technical support.
Usually in an industrial environment, the source code is never modified as it is only giving a specific answer to a specific mechanical solution. Usually what get's broken is the mechanical part or the electrical part, not the software itself.
Giving the fact that the initial testing and the FAT/SAT tests are passed successfully, the customer should not need technical support in a future unless something mechanical or electrical is wrong so nothing to do with the software development.
Anyway, of course they are in their right to be worried, as you say, I've heard several times the question myself: "what happens if you die tomorrow?"... I usually answer that my team can take care of the project or that in the worst case scenario the insurance I have will cover their needs... but this is another thing and I don't know what my friend will do...
Thank you very much for your post!
|
|
|
|
|
Joan Murt wrote: The customer is scared about the future and how will you give technical support as you are a one man company.
Since you claim you're the only one at the moment, I'd say you'd be better at it then the competition.
As for technical support, "how much" support would they require? Initial documentation, QA for endusers, or implementing new features at no cost?
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
|
|
|
|
|
Yes, my friend is in a nice position regarding knowledge and so, but he is still a "one man company".
The future technical support should not be a very big thing, in fact, when the machine will be ended the only expected problems after the initial testing and the FAT/SAT tests should be electrical and mechanical things, not software issues...
- Initial documentation -> OK.
- Training -> OK.
- Implementing new features at no cost -> NOT OK.
So they should be fine with that...
|
|
|
|
|
Joan Murt wrote: Yes, my friend is in a nice position regarding knowledge and so, but he is still a "one man company".
He is the only company providing the service. It matters not if he hires a canteen-lady, two accountants, a manager, a marketing-man and a friggin' chauffeur - he would still be the only person in the only company providing the service*.
Meaning such things even exist in "large" companies; if they want to have the security that someone posesses the knowledge to help them out in the case that something happens, then that is as simple as paying for another employee and training him/her. If it is worth the money, it is worth considering.
Joan Murt wrote: The future technical support should not be a very big thing
Enough to "worry" your customer, or he is not giving you the real reason.
--edit;
Meaning there is no competition and hence no (cheaper) alternative. If they need the solution and worry, they'll help you out. If they simply state that they're worried without evaluating any possible solutions, they're probably looking for a simple way to ditch it.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
|
|
|
|
|
Put your ass on the line. Create some form of written agreement making some promise that you have to keep else the customer wins... E.g. half the money now, half when the work is done. Or, some money is paid after the support contract is completed. Or, tell him the support prices rate for when the standard support is complete. This will show the customer you are thinking long term, and are professional.
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence."
<< please vote!! >></div>
|
|
|
|
|
All of this has been done, dividing the milestones in start, material delivery, pass off completed (note this is after all the tests and after all the system has been working for one month without errors), then there is one year of free maintenance and a specified price rate for questions that are not related to mistakes on the software (which is already covered for free during the first year).
The problem is not looking professional here, my friend is a one man company so no opportunity to break the doubts of his customers by looking professional... this is a must but it is already solved...
Thank you for posting!
|
|
|
|
|
Walk softly and carry a big stick.
New version: WinHeist Version 2.2.2 Beta tomorrow (noun): a mystical land where 99% of all human productivity, motivation and achievement is stored.
|
|
|
|
|
Holy cow!
Now my friend needs not only to look professional, but to hire someone to help him... a gun as suggested by our outlaw, then a stick... who will carry the laptop?
Thank you for posting Mike!
|
|
|
|
|
As a one man company, for the past 36 years, this is a question I have repeatedly run into in the past. The answer that worked the best for me, while counter-intuitive, is really simple.
I point out Microsoft.
That's right. I point out that Microsoft (and other large companies) are significantly MORE likely to drop support for a product with little or no notice, than I am to get hit by a bus, shot by a jealous husband, etc. Also that they are significantly more likely to change the UI (forcing employee re-training).
Then I point out that they are a much bigger fish in my little pond and have more influence. I can and will modify the program to suit them (yes I tell them it will cost but they will get what they want, something unlikely with my larger competitors).
Finally, I point out that I am in the business for the long haul. Most of my customers have been with me more than 15 years, some 30 years.
I never got all of the ones I quoted, but the way I lose a client these days is the owner sells out or dies.
The real secret is that businessmen want tomorrow to be pretty much like today.
"Never trust a dog with orange eyebrows..." T.P.
|
|
|
|
|
Is really a jealous husband out there?
I've heard they are really dangerous...
Thank you for posting!
|
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
