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We're still using 2003 because management won't let me migrate.
Besides the support issue and technological deficit created, there are other issues you don't even think about. For example, I have to tell customers to use Compatibility View for IE 10+ because IIS doesn't recognize the web browser and then Web Forms do not work.
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Agile has its roots in the Agile Manifesto, the product of 17 software developers coming together in 2001 to talk over development methods. And now one of those developers, Andy Hunt, has taken to his blog to argue that Agile has some serious issues. It's certainly not a failing concept to write articles about how it's a failing concept
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A few people failing to implement the concept doesn't mean it's a flawed concept.
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PIEBALDconsult wrote: A few people failing to implement the concept doesn't mean it's a flawed concept.
On the other hand, slavishly adhering to the concept usually leads to the process becoming more important than the product and that can never be a good thing.
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I had not seen your comment until I popped over here to add my comment:
Agile as a religion may be a failure, but as a practice, it takes some determination to find a dev shop not using it in some way. Just that, to me, is a clear mark of success.
No object is so beautiful that, under certain conditions, it will not look ugly. - Oscar Wilde
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Also true. I have instigated agile but in a way that I thought suited the culture and the objectives. That worked well for me.
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PIEBALDconsult wrote: A few people failing to implement the concept doesn't mean it's a flawed concept.
A very good point. Except maybe "a few people" could be "a whole lot of people". and I also notice that you do not call them developers, engineers, architects, etc.  Most likely it's the PMs and Ms of all types.
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It's ironic, because the Manifesto is pretty good, but the way it's been put into practice, yes, absolutely, is a failure right out of the gate in just about every way possible.
But then again, every methodology has failed, so perhaps the question to ask is "has Agile failed the least?"
Marc
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I'm just now reading a very good book which incorporates Agile Methodology.
Adaptive Code Via C# by Gary McLean Hall (amazon link)[^]
It's great because it's a Devs view of Agile in practice and how it helps you create Adaptive Code -- which is a great term for a great idea.
That's what Agile should be about.
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newton.saber wrote: I'm just now reading a very good book which incorporates Agile Methodology.
Heh, one reviewer's comment:
This book is a game-changer for the C# community. Scrum, patterns, the SOLID principles and clean code all have their roots more or less in the Java language.
I guess the reviewer is implying the C# community has its head where the sun don't shine.
Marc
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Here[^]'s a manifesto as an answer to your manifesto.
Marc Clifton wrote: so perhaps the question to ask is "has Agile failed the least?"
The question you'd have to ask, is whether or not it adds value.
Yes, I can see the added value in the description; instead of crafting software, it evolves. Means more flexibility during the proces, but also introduces some uncertainties.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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IMHO, the best thing about agile is that decisions are not imposed, but collective; leading to more ownership.
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Avijnata wrote: the best thing about agile is that decisions are not imposed
In all the places I've worked that have claimed to be "agile", I've never seen that. Decisions are always imposed.
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Was a scrum-master for three years, and always took decisions in consultation with the senior team members.
We were a highly-rated team too.
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As a senior developer, sometimes I can suggest ideas, sometimes I can influence decisions, when I'm really lucky I can demonstrate a number of options, but the end decisions is always made by managers, business analysts, sales teams or end users.
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Avijnata wrote: decisions are not imposed, but collective; leading to more ownership
Right. Meaning you don't fall over the Water Fall (methodology) then look back at what failed and blame one programmer for misinterpreting the vision. Instead the whole team is on the hook.
The problem is...you have to talk to people a lot. Ugh. Yes, I'm kidding.
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Kent Sharkey wrote: It's certainly not a failing concept to write articles about how it's a failing concept
Now there's an article idea.. "'Considered Harmful' considered harmful".
Damn, someone beat me to it... Considered harmful essays considered harmful.[^]
"If you don't fail at least 90 percent of the time, you're not aiming high enough."
Alan Kay.
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And you can make money initially promoting it and later by calling it useless!
Consultants are very good at these things.
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There is no clear definition of 'agile' that I can use to answer the question. Some shops take a few of the best practices and call themselves Agile. To me, it looks as if they're delivering prototypes, with various levels of testing (means usually very little).
I have also not seen a single agile-project yet where the deliverables have been on time. So, as far as I can see, it is merely a collection of good idea's that may or may not work in your setting.
Until I see it work, I'll remain a cynic.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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The web definitely has a speed problem due to over-design and the junkyard of tools people feel they have to include on every single web page. "I'm not fat! I'm getting in shape! Beefcake!"
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Is it just me that feels that this thread and your next thread are connected?
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 We may just have a theme, now that you mention it 
TTFN - Kent
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To Jay Silver, a banana isn’t just a banana. It’s a piano key or selfie-stick button, or control pad for a video game. But I already have one?
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