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I fancy myself a 'good' programmer, as do most employed coders i suppose. But one thing that being a good programmer doesn't make you good at is setting up projects. I actually had to turn down a job as the 'sole web programmer' at a makeup start-up because I couldn't setup the project in 8 hours. I tried the for my WHOLE first day of employment to setup that project and went home as a failure. I was too darn ashamed too return the next day and give another hopeless attempt.
So as I am in setup HELL with this dang nabbit c++ and starting a new HELL MODE, I just want to know how much time would yall estimate you've spent in Project Setup HELL?
50 hours lifetime total is my estimate.
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A week and a half.
Java/GWT with about a dozen different internal and third-party frameworks all cooperating and competing. Really makes me appreciate Visual Studio and C#/.NET...
Granted, it was my first time using a Java IDE in over ten years, but still...
EDIT: Oh, and sorry, that's not lifetime... That's one project.
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I have the exact same experience with GWT.
No matter what third-party library you use, at some point it will be deprecated.
I never understood why we're using that stuff in the first place. (I'm a C#/.NET junkie)
Recently, we tried to switch to Vaadin. (Sort of GWT with a shell)
When installing it, we followed every step laid out on the website, then I create a new project: errors! Red squigglies all over the place. Just by creating a new project!
Never mind that stuff. Java and everything associated with it is dead to me.
C#/.NET/Visual Studio all the way! The phrase 'It just works' is so true.
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Yeah, had kind of same experience. That's why in our dev platform we pay a lot of attention to this "Project Stetup" step. I would appreciate you check it out and share your view on what we do [^].
From my perspective if framework cannot be launched in 10 mins then just f*ck it and move to another one. So, this idea is one of the fundamentals ones, that stands behind the CUBA Platform
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What do you mean by project setup, exactly?
I don't think anything with the word "project" in it, takes less then 8 hours; just guessing. 
If you are quitting after the first day, I would question that motivation first, before your skill set for "setting up" a project.
You don't make it in this business, by quitting. Just saying...
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I assumed he meant the time it takes to install all of the required third-party libraries, configure the IDE, etc...
Essentially the time between pulling the code from the repository and being able to successfully compile it.
Visual Studio makes that really easy...
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Ah, I see.
Well, if he inherited a mess, then it most likely could take a day or two, at least, to sort things out. However, nothing to quit over.
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From when you receive the project until when you run the project.
Should I just expect the bag of files I'm given to actually run right the first time?!
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Yoda Bytes wrote: I tried the for my WHOLE first day of employment to setup that project and went home as a failure.
Are you saying that you couldn't finish because it was a lot of work, or that you kept getting it wrong and having to restart?
Either way, it's nothing to quit over -- unless, of course, you fed them a lot of bull during the hiring process.
I need more information before I can call you an idiot with conviction!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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BOTH ARE TRUE. And I can be convicted with conviction of possessing the intellect of a converted convict.
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Not quite sure what you mean... Open up Visual Studio (or Eclipse, or what-have-you), click 'File -> New project', if applicable choose the template of your choice, et voilá! Takes about 5 minutes on a slow computer. I guess that's not what kept you busy for an entire day (or I've got some bad news for you...).
My blog[ ^]
public class SanderRossel : Lazy<Person>
{
public void DoWork()
{
throw new NotSupportedException();
}
}
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I see you marked his post with 'NoEffort' and 'GimmieCode' 
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Need prjct urgentz plz!!!11
My blog[ ^]
public class SanderRossel : Lazy<Person>
{
public void DoWork()
{
throw new NotSupportedException();
}
}
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Maybe he's talking about a C++ project in Visual Studio. All the libraries and linking and everything can become terribly difficult. I remember back from the days of VC++ 4,5,6 etc.
It can be a real wormhole you fall into, trying to get build order and all that.
It's far more difficult than the C# stuff. I'm saying this as a C# dev.
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New project - 2-3 hours for silverlight/wpf but then we have been working with our framework for 4-5 years.
Taking over someone else's code can take forever, especially if the source is crap or you have limited knowledge of the tech used.
Quitting after 1 days effort is well... rather sad, unless you have recognised that you are incapable of doing the job.
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity
RAH
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Once my Eclipse IDE said some of jar files are corrupted , I was not able fix the problem after a day.
I then formatted the PC and reinstall all the stuff again, it took me 2 days to get the workspace working.
I hate those freaking classpath that are scattered throughout of my computer.
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So, I got my MCSA to satisfy the requirements of the job, and I can see, create, delete, and edit stored procedures, but I can't execute do anything with them. I can even pull the SQL out of a stored procedure and run it in a query window, but I cannot execute/edit/etc the stored procedures - that I wrote.
I hate my job.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
modified 26-Jan-15 13:14pm.
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Moronic Dilbertland. You need a new job.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert Einstein
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If it is any consolation I have also fallen foul of exactly the same situation.
Boss - "Our auditors say that developers should not be able to run the SPs in Production"
Me - "But this isn't Production!"
Boss - "But it is modelled on Production"
Me - "But I can edit them!"
Boss - "Well, it's your job to edit them, you just can't run them"
...
You can imagine the follow up conversation with the Test Manager 
Fortunately the DBA saw the light and created a test id with execute rights. So, no personal responsibility as the test id is shared but the auditors are ok with that 
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Thhis isn't even an outward facing SQL server - it's solely for the use of the department in which I'm working.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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I don't have the benefit of everyone sitting in a room together, or even that of an enlightened DBA. The security is "governed" by the Information Assurance nazis, and the DBA can only give access to the level they dictate. Even if he WAS enlightened, it wouldn't make a difference. I have to go through five layers of bureaucracy to get anything done around here.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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So hell does exist...
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert Einstein
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Are we talking about a development environment?
How a developer can done the job if can't run the SPs?
Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
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Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter wrote: How a developer can done the job if can't run the SPs?
Speak for yourself. I do all my coding in NotePad and deploy to production during business hours. Only sissies need to test their code. 
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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I would like to see how you handle 1,450,000 lines of SQL code with notepad... 
Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
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