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jschell15-Dec-12 11:34

15-Dec-12 11:34

Yayozama wrote:
Well, you seem to be confusing the organized crime (drug delears, narcos, mafia, cartels, etc...) with "normal" people...

I am not "confusing" anything. A lot of people are dying by being shot. So your claim is obviously specious since certainly people can get guns and ammunition. And it appears a lot of them can get them.

And the fact that there are illegal doesn't seem to stop people dieing from them.

Yayozama wrote:
You don't hear about someone going postal in my country

There is NO direct correlation between guns themselves and mass shootings. That is a cultural difference. Obviously more guns means more possibilities but the cultural is the driving force.

Yayozama15-Dec-12 13:09

Yayozama

15-Dec-12 13:09

jschell wrote:
A lot of people are dying by being shot. So your claim is obviously specious since certainly people can get guns and ammunition. And it appears a lot of them can get them.

And the fact that there are illegal doesn't seem to stop people dieing from them.

Look, I'm not telling (as you can see in my other messages) that people can't get a gun in my country... that would be ridiculous.
What I'm saying is [and here is where I don't understand your "specious" claim] that most of the news that you hear about people diying in violents acts (related to guns) are because of the war between the drug cartels and/or the police. And if you believe that THOSE guns were purchased in the streets, sorry, you are wrong.

jschell wrote:
There is NO direct correlation between guns themselves and mass shootings. That is a cultural difference. Obviously more guns means more possibilities but the cultural is the driving force.

Yes, I can understand your point... but if your culture actually involve a [relative] lot of people using to harm others [kids in this case!!!], why can't you get a little more laws to actually get a gun?

Again, look... I'm not criticising all of you [pro or anti gun], because I don't live in your country. I'm only saying what it would be my stance if I were.
Like I said to JSOP: your laws, for good or for worse... so be it.

#realJSOP14-Dec-12 14:51

14-Dec-12 14:51

*Law abiding* citizens obey the law, and become victims of the bad guys that don't (the drug cartels).

".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997

Yayozama15-Dec-12 13:27

Yayozama

15-Dec-12 13:27

Yes... and what's the point?
That we all should be armed in the streets to kill THAT bad guys?
Yes, I can't see how that could go wrong...

That's the work of the police and the army... and they are doing their jobs (more slowly that I want, but they are catching a lot of drug lords -the problem is that the head grow faster again).

#realJSOP16-Dec-12 4:50

16-Dec-12 4:50

Yayozama wrote:
That we all should be armed in the streets to kill THAT bad guys?

Until existing laws are enforced, that is the only right answer. In Mexico, however, the government is apparently just as corrupt as the people they're supposed to be apprehending, at least in the jurisdictions that matter.

Yayozama wrote:
That's the work of the police and the army... and they are doing their jobs (more slowly that I want, but they are catching a lot of drug lords -the problem is that the head grow faster again).

The problem is that they're probably working *for* another drug lord (that's paying them more than all the others) to help exterminate the competition.

Yayozama17-Dec-12 4:25

Yayozama

17-Dec-12 4:25

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Until existing laws are enforced, that is the only right answer.

So, you kill someone related to a BIG drug delear... and you put you and your family at risk of a vendetta.
Yes, that sound right.

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
In Mexico, however, the government is apparently just as corrupt as the people they're supposed to be apprehending, at least in the jurisdictions that matter.

Yeah, I know (I'm not playing a blind man, you know?)
But, I firmly believe that (in the last years at least) the goverment is trying to control the BIG cartels (and the corruption is waaaay below that level).
I mean, a low drug delear will not come out killing innocent people.

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
The problem is that they're probably working *for* another drug lord (that's paying them more than all the others) to help exterminate the competition.

"probably" is the keyword.
Yes, I know how corrupt is/was the goverment, but I think that if we had an easy access to guns, this would be a utter chaos. At least they are doing their job (step by step), and now there's more in play (polliticaly) than ever...

#realJSOP14-Dec-12 9:08

14-Dec-12 9:08

But in order to do so, you would have to buy one illegally. You then become a criminal, and fall into the "nature of that ilk" category. Why should *legal* gun owners be punished for something you did with an *illegally* purchased gun?

Mladen Janković14-Dec-12 10:11

Mladen Janković

14-Dec-12 10:11

RugbyLeague wrote:

Gun control is the only solution

Yeah sure: Winnenden school shooting[^].

[edit] And how could I forget Mr Breivik[^]

GALex

modified 14-Dec-12 16:20pm.

RugbyLeague14-Dec-12 12:31

14-Dec-12 12:31

You seem to be under the impression that guns should be available because other people go beserk with guns

User 58385214-Dec-12 10:42

User 583852

14-Dec-12 10:42

Don't go applying logic, these people have an old document that says guns are their rright!

jschell14-Dec-12 13:22

14-Dec-12 13:22

RugbyLeague wrote:
I am in the UK - if I was going to go postal I wouldn't have a clue where to get hold of a gun

Here you go. Took me about 30 seconds.

http://www.sportsmanguncentre.co.uk/find-us/[^]

But thankfully the UK has outlawed google for criminals.

RugbyLeague14-Dec-12 13:31

14-Dec-12 13:31

Did you miss this bit:

"Due to current UK Laws we are unable to sell any firearm directly through our website, as we need to see an original firearms certificate."

jschell15-Dec-12 11:30

15-Dec-12 11:30

RugbyLeague wrote:
Did you miss this bit:

Since that had nothing to do with the your posting what does it have to do with my response?

You said "if I was going to go postal I wouldn't have a clue where to get hold of a gun"

I showed you exactly where one could get a gun.

RugbyLeague15-Dec-12 14:01

15-Dec-12 14:01

If you have all the correct paperwork.

#realJSOP16-Dec-12 4:51

16-Dec-12 4:51

RugbyLeague wrote:
If you have all the correct paperwork.

You mean the correct amount of paperwork (as in cash on hand).

RugbyLeague16-Dec-12 5:41

16-Dec-12 5:41

no, the correct paperwork

jschell17-Dec-12 8:16

17-Dec-12 8:16

RugbyLeague wrote:

If you have all the correct paperwork.

Again that still has nothing to do with what you posted and to what I responded to.

If you want to re-state what you meant then go for it.

RugbyLeague17-Dec-12 22:02

17-Dec-12 22:02

It has everything to do with it

jschell18-Dec-12 7:59

18-Dec-12 7:59

RugbyLeague wrote:

It has everything to do with it

It has nothing to do with what you posted.

The word "where" has a specific definition. Perhaps you had some other non-standard definition in mind.

RugbyLeague18-Dec-12 21:51

18-Dec-12 21:51

I couldn't get a gun there so it is valid. I still don't know where I could get a gun.

jschell19-Dec-12 12:54

19-Dec-12 12:54

RugbyLeague wrote:
I couldn't get a gun there so it is valid.

Because you are physically unable to drive from that UK location from your UK location?

Or because you don't want to fulfill the paperwork requirement? Or you are ineligible to buy a gun in the first place?

None of those have anything to do with the word "where".

Eddy Vluggen14-Dec-12 8:40

Eddy Vluggen

14-Dec-12 8:40

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
In this particular instance, a school is considered a "gun-free zone" (federal law). BY LAW, you cannot bring a gun into a school.

Michael Moore ‏@MMFlint

Just 18 hrs ago, those Republicans in the Michigan House rammed thru a bill making it LEGAL to carry a gun into a school or day care center.

Bastard Programmer from Hell Suspicious | :suss:

If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
They hate us for our freedom![^]

harold aptroot14-Dec-12 9:21

harold aptroot

14-Dec-12 9:21

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
The best solution is remote decentralized teaching/learning. The kids are safer, but they don't learn other essential skills.

But maybe that can be solved - simply make those skills non-essential.

I mean f*** interaction with other humans. Why hasn't that been recognized as a problem and treated accordingly (ie solved) yet? It's a massive drain of time and energy, and therefore money.

Kevin Marois14-Dec-12 10:18

Kevin Marois

14-Dec-12 10:18

John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
The solution isn't arming the teachers.

Maybye not, but statistics show that states with CCW's have lower crime rates. One armed person could have stopped this guy before he got to that classroom.

If it's not broken, fix it until it is