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[having just got up from an afternoon nap] fully agree
Message Signature
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 Our cat has mastered all positions 
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Or self-knowlegde as I like to call it.
How come people looking for a dev are selecting on arrogance? I'm good at what I do, and won't play humble. My proposed rewards might be, but if you hire me, I'm selected to do what I do. If you think you can find someone better, then please do.
This is a serious complaint; do you want your surgeon to say it is a "challenge" to get your appendix out? Programming isn't a challenge, it's mostly a boring thing that takes a lot of time; procreate your nonsense about sexy and innovation. You ain't up to date with your security, you don't get to talk about innovation.
Don't come to me whining about me not having worked for a year, unless you need to be put in your place. It's not like Windows has been redesigned, or that all previous languages stopped working. I will call you out as the fraud you are 
I'm back, and for sale. Any offer is evaluated.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Sorry I can't help with the job, but if a bit of moral support is worth it... I agree with you.
Even if something got up and I / we are not a master in it yet... it doesn't mean it can't be learnt pretty fast. But our skills set... that's not something you find everywhere.
I got rejected once, because I didn't know something they were expecting. My answer "give me 3 months with someone who can it or 6 months alone, and I will can it at least at 'normal' if not 'advanced' level" was not good enough for them. I got something else and 18 months later, they were still searching for someone.
Right now... I am damned happy they didn't get me. I wouldn't be where I now am, and I like where I am.
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Nelek wrote: I got rejected once, because I didn't know something they were expecting.
People often expect the wrong thing.
Nelek wrote: I got something else and 18 months later, they were still searching for someone.
No, they ain't searching someone; they advertising for free. Not every vacancy is meant to be filled; half of them are out there just to create an image.
No company looks for five years for the same vacancy. That's PR, nothing more. Not every ad that asks for workers is actually serious about hiring. Some of them just want to look succesful. Ask to see code when in doubt.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote: No, they ain't searching someone; they advertising for free. Not every vacancy is meant to be filled; half of them are out there just to create an image.
Yes, they were searching.
But they didn't find anyone as long as the 2nd on charge had something to say. He was the one rejecting me because I didn't know X. During the interview he told "I want to find someone who I can trust, as the guy XXYYZZ who I can blindly trust, if he says 'that won't work', that won't get out of the test lab".
My question: "How long has he been doing this?"
Boss' answer: over 15 years
Me:   (And I have only asked for 6 months...) Stood up and said: Thanks for your time, have a nice afternoon.
The department eventually got a new boss, and they then filled the vacancy some weeks later (22 months after my interview).
Eddy Vluggen wrote: That's PR, nothing more. Not every ad that asks for workers is actually serious about hiring. Some of them just want to look succesful.
I know... I have seen that and other tactics i.e.
Offers that ask for impossibles, just to frigthen people that might get intimidated
Offers that ask for very vague things so that you are supposed to do everything, from coding to cleaning bathrooms
Offers already assigned before getting public (one that I found interesting and wanted to apply to was published on friday, was there for a full week and got deleted on following monday because HHRR were forced to make the offers public in at least 3 weeks, please note the "in" and the missing "for").
...
But, as I said, I am really happy they didn't hire me that time... I like what I now do way more than what I was expected to do there.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Nelek wrote: During the interview he told "I want to find someone who I can trust
The company that hires me can trust me. If this comes up during an interview, I will complain to the shareholders.
Primus - The Devil Went Down To Georgia - YouTube[^]
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Wouldn't be much fun if we all liked the same music 
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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I probably agree with you, but I can't actually follow your train thought.
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PIEBALDconsult wrote: I probably agree with you, but I can't actually follow your train thought.
So you (probably) agree without understanding what I say?
That's the best compliment of the year - tx for the sentiment, and drop a line if you need my (free) help - though seeing your rep, you don't need it 
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Eddy no, I had trouble following your rant.... not just the other guy - maybe semantics.
Arrogance is not the same thing as competence. Ponder that.
First rule of management: hire people smarter than you.
Second rule: fire the assholes.
Charlie Gilley
<italic>Stuck in a dysfunctional matrix from which I must escape...
"Where liberty dwells, there is my country." B. Franklin, 1783
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
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PIEBALDconsult wrote: I can't actually follow your train thought.
I agree with that part. 
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other.
Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it.
Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote: Programming isn't a challenge
True, programming isn't a challenge, but it sure is a challenge to figure out WTF the person who did the programming was thinking, as most "programmers" I've encountered are, well, programming-challenged.
And that includes numerous third party packages and API's I've had to work with over the years as well. 
People seem to confuse programming with algorithm and architecture design. Algorithms and architectures can definitely be challenging. Once figured out, yeah, the programming is usually significantly less challenging.
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Marc Clifton wrote: but it sure is a challenge to figure out WTF the person who did the programming was thinking, as most "programmers" I've encountered are, well, programming-challenged.
Don't waste time; ask what it is supposed to do, and stop the digging into some Egyptian tomb of old knowledge. Find out what is does, and replace it within a day or two.
Marc Clifton wrote: And that includes numerous third party packages and API's I've had to work with over the years as well.
Their limitations aren't (prolly) stopping your salespeople from promising the sky. Let them keep their promises or shut the F*** up.
Marc Clifton wrote: People seem to confuse programming with algorithm and architecture design. Algorithms and architectures can definitely be challenging. Once figured out, yeah, the programming is usually significantly less challenging.
I happen to like those two area's, but it is not challenging. I know what I am doing, just like the surgeon who is going to cut into you. If your vacancy says you looking for someone who thinks that's a challenge, I WILL publicly point you out as a company that is looking for a cheap noob.
If you one of the companies receiving a letter from me looking for a job, then shiver.
I had it with the nonsense, and will call out anyone who provides it.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote: ask what it is supposed to do
Real life example: Hard to do when it was written in Ruby by a programmer that no longer works at the company, there is no documentation, and I'm the only other dev that's even ever worked with Ruby.
Eddy Vluggen wrote: but it is not challenging. I know what I am doing
I've had to design some algorithms that nobody, even PhD level people weren't able to solve. Granted, by the time you get a PhD you approach every problem with the hammer you know, but still, this stuff was freaking complicated. And quite frankly, I had no idea how to approach the problem, but because I kept an open mind to crazy ideas, I was, and still am, the only person to have come up with a workable implementation that the company uses to this day.
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Marc Clifton wrote: I've had to design some algorithms that nobody, even PhD level people weren't able to solve.
Yeah, that would be a challenge.
Not one I would fancy taking; usually just doing office-automation, which is the most common development work around here ever since the demand for "websites" dropped. The place where you use common patterns, without calling it R&D. That's usually not something that requires a Mark Zuckerberg.
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Arrogance may be fine if you work alone, but mostly others are involved. I can tell from experience that it's pretty annoying when people are too arrogant to take good advice. The best developers IMHO are the ones that doubt everything they do, and double check to test everything works. So my motto is: don't be arrogant !
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Exactly right.
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RickZeeland wrote: that it's pretty annoying when people are too arrogant to take good advice.
Good point
Bastard Programmer from Hell
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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RickZeeland wrote: The best developers IMHO are the ones that doubt everything they do
Then I must be a really good developer.
Nah, I doubt that.
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In my experience, arrogant people are often people who try to stealth their lack of self-confidence.
"Five fruits and vegetables a day? What a joke!
Personally, after the third watermelon, I'm full."
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