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After yet another dismal British summer (link[^]), I've been thinking about whether to have a go at working abroad (which includes moving the family out with me  ).
I'm considering the US, Canada and New Zealand (Australia would be too hot for my delicate British nature), but thought I'd ask people from those parts what it's really like to work in software and what the general lifestyles are like? Where are the best regions to find work and nice places to live?
If there are any Brits that have moved already, how do things compare with the UK?
It's difficult to get a realistic view from the internet (does that surprise anyone?) - it's either everywhere abroad is awful, or everywhere abroad is paradise - so I thought I'd ask here 
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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If you hate British summers, I would recommend you to give northern Alaska a try. Maybe what you have is not all that bad! 
Life is too shor
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I did do a couple of years in Russia, it was quite nice in winter. -40C, snow everywhere, interesting to see people skiing to work
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Like everything in this world most places have advantages and disadvantages. First you need to understand what sort of lifestyle you are after as that has a bearing on the location, weather and local culture.
Not that I'm pushing Aussie, but you have to remember it is a large place from the tropics to Tasmania in the south with weather to much the extremes.
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We're pretty active, do a lot of outdoor activities - hiking, rock climbing, camping, kayaking, that kind of thing
As well as the heat, the number of killer creatures in and around Australia (as reported by the media  ) has kind of dissuaded me somewhat too. Not sure how big a problem it is there though in reality?
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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It really depends where you are. For the most part they are not too much of an issue on a day to day basis in the cities. Just need a few basic precautions.
NZ is good for outdoors things but the market is small as the population is only about 4 million in total.Mostly stationary in Auckland motorway system If you not a city person the possibilities of lifestyle are all great outside Auckland.
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I think for NZ, Auckland would be the sensible choice for a software developer
I've heard that food and general goods in NZ can be expensive, but that the lifestyle is generally good? Would be interesting to hear from anyone out that way at the moment
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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We hear about the high food prices as well. But to us it's just normal life and it's not all about money but the lifestyle you can have, which more than compensates.
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Yep, I agree - as long as you're not going hungry or worrying about using electric
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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 work in electricity sector.. They've got too pay me so it goes to a good cause 
Our winter bill ave about $180 month here and $70 month at the beach prop. Not too bad. All depends on you income. Conversion probably give false results compared to living here.
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We pay about the same here for gas and electric combined. Do you use electric for heating, or is there a separate bill for that?
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Although we have gas in NZ, I do not use it. So just electricity. We do however use wood burning fireplace in our main home and air con at the beach.
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The way things are going, there should be quite a bit of work coming up in North Africa. Are you any good driving a tank?
veni bibi saltavi
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Can I work remotely from a Caribbean Island?
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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Probably safer, but you have to buy your own rum punch!
veni bibi saltavi
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That's hardware!
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Worse: that's an Operator!
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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Urghh.. was hoping to avoid the meeja, espcially the likes of the Guardian, Torygraph, In(the EU)dependent, DM, etc.
One week a place can be the best place on earth, the next week the same place is awful. It's the extreme polarised views from the meeja and the interwebs that's led me to ask people here
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Forget Europe. The north, where there is some work, is as wet as the UK, the south is in the third world when it comes to IT.
The US? If you like life cheap and cheerful then sure, California is the place. Good sun, good skiing, crap sea though, its glacial.
Canada? If good weather is 6 months below zero then OK.
NZ? Is there any IT work there?
Sydney, Australia. Probably your best bet, that is if the Chinese slow down doesn't cripple their economy too much. But its got skiing, sun, countryside, a great city, good food.
Singapore perhaps if you are in banking?
However, if you can get work in or around Barcelona then its a great place. Europes hidden gem. Great coast, skiing on your door step. Like the Cote d'Azur in France, but a third the price. Talking of which, Sophia and Valbonne in the south of France is the one place there is an IT hot spot. The rest sucks. Low wages, utter crap.
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Munchies_Matt wrote: the south is in the third world when it comes to IT.
The truth, it hurts 
Geek code v 3.12 {
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- r++>+++ y+++*
Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
}
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
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I live in the south of france, have done for a long time, and spend most of my time contracting in northern Europe.... and missing my family. But that's the f***ing stupid sh*tty choice we made!
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I live in the north of Italy (in Piedmont, adjoining France, by the way) and luckily I work for Food & Beverage customers and we provide automated QA inspection machinery, so I do not properly work in the IT field despite being a programmer.
There weren't many other choices anyway... mainly "startups", which seems it is the new term for "playground funded with Dad's remaining money that will ultimately crumble to dust for its debts".
Geek code v 3.12 {
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- r++>+++ y+++*
Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
}
If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver
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Munchies_Matt wrote: The US? If you like life cheap and cheerful then sure, California is the place.
I think for the US (and access to sea and hills/mountains) it'd probably have to be California. Not sure what area though?
Canada - I'm guessing Totonto would be the natural choice, but don't know much about how things are there, or if it's easy to get out and do things. The cold isn't too much of an issue if winter sports are on the cards
NZ - I've seen a few companies. IT/software are on their list of upcoming industries/skills in need and the outdoor opportunities are a big plus.
Aus - seems popular, but is it getting too popular?
At the moment I'm a contractor, current assignment is in finance but I'd prefer to be doing something else after this stint's up
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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California? I guess in certain places, the place is falling apart and has been for some time. Can't complain about the weather if you are close enough to the coast. Other than that, most of the state is semi-arid to arid.
A lot of California moved to Arizona (lived in Tucson in the early 80s), and it's a crime what they did to a perfectly good desert state. The bumper sticker at the time was "Don't Californicate Arizona". The same thing happened to Colorado and is now happening to Texas, but there are a lot more Texans, so I have hope for the Lone Star State.
I have clients in California, so most of the time I go there its on business. It's nice, if you can afford to live there. It sounds like you are more into a life style change rather than a career expanding move. That usually points you away from the hot spots of development (Silicon Valley, New York, Boston - all high cost of living or long commutes). Sounds like what you are looking for is a 4 season climate, relative short drives?
Best of luck on your search.
Charlie Gilley
<italic>Stuck in a dysfunctional matrix from which I must escape...
"Where liberty dwells, there is my country." B. Franklin, 1783
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
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