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Dominic Burford wrote: TFS needs to be connected constantly to your network
Not true. You can work disconnected. When you go back online, TFS is smart enough to be able to reconcile your changes.
/ravi
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See my later reply. Yes it does, but the default operation is to work in connected mode. Contrast this with other tools such as Git and Subversion that work in a completely disconnected mode.
"There are two ways of constructing a software design: One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies, and the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult." - C.A.R. Hoare
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I have heard that TFS is good and getting better.
It is more than a Source Control system, so I have been told.
We don't use it, but that is not because it is bad. We use Rally for Agile project management and Bitbucket/Git for source control. So far, so good.
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TFS is better than it used to be and it is more than source control, but that may be where the problem lies.
My source control preferences in order are Git, SVN then TFS - unfortunately TFS seems to be the most commonly used in the companies I tend to be involved with.
Git and SVN don't have tools built in for managing Agile projects but I wouldn't say that the ones in TFS are great. Many people install Telerik's TFS Work Item Manager to fill in some of the gaps.
Personally I'd recommend finding a 3rd party solution (such as JetBrains YouTrack or JIRA) for managing projects - even better if you can get one that can be hooked into check-ins from TFS, Git or SVN.
Just about every developer I've worked with dislikes using TFS - me included 
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Brent Jenkins wrote: even better if you can get one that can be hooked into check-ins from TFS, Git or SVN.
I agree.
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Brent Jenkins wrote: ust about every developer I've worked with dislikes using TFS - me included 
I understand the feeling, but try using ClearQuest, TFS will be heaven for you. 
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BugTracker.NET has excellent integration with Subversion and Mercurial, and is written in ASP.NET, and is completely customisable. I used it in a previous company I worked for and found it to be a great tool 
"There are two ways of constructing a software design: One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies, and the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult." - C.A.R. Hoare
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I'll have to take a look at that one, thanks
How do you know so much about swallows? Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
modified 31-Aug-21 21:01pm.
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Agreed. Once again, instead of solving a specific problem, Microsoft tries to solve a gamut of them, and doesn't do any piece of it great.
That being said, TFS is improving; I haven't had the mystery "oh, the repository only sent me some of the modifications" in quite some time.
I don't think the work tracking is very good, but I'm developing and don't have to worry about that much. It just seems cumbersome and not user-friendly to try to use as a time tracking tool. What I hear from the product management types is they don't feel it's great either.
Recommend subversion + Jira or FogBugz, some tools which specialize in each problem space.
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The group I'm in has been using TFS for the last few years and I like it.
Previously we used Subversion (which is not suitable for use with code projects) and had no way of tracking work.
I do not integrate TFS with my Visual Studio projects, because that's not how I work.
I use the Web interface, the command-line, the shell extension, and some utilities I wrote against the API.
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How can you use TFS and not use it?
I mean
PIEBALDconsult wrote: I do not integrate TFS with my Visual Studio projects, because that's not how I work.
VS comes with TFS support build in.
How can you not use TFS in VS and use it from outside?
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shrknt35 wrote: VS comes with TFS support build in.
It has support for VB and F# too, but I don't use them.
shrknt35 wrote: How can you not use TFS in VS
There are things I do with TFS from within VS, but not integrated with with my projects.
shrknt35 wrote: use it from outside?
Commmand-line, shell extensions, API.
Besides, this thread is about Tasks, not code. Tasks I maintain with the Web interface.
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We investigated using it for our task tracking and after 15 mins of trying to make heads or tails of it I gave up.
It feels like the process of doing sprints and cards and backlogs and burndowns and everything else in the various templates that are offered have completely taken priority over actually - y'know - managing your tasks.
Anything that is harder to use than an Excel spreadsheet get's thrown in the bin for us. TFS / VSO has great potential, but not until they focus on the data (ie tasks) instead of the process (ie their overly complicated workflow and terrible UI)
cheers
Chris Maunder
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Chris Maunder wrote: Anything that is harder to use than an Excel spreadsheet get's thrown in the bin for us. TFS / VSO has great potential, but not until they focus on the data (ie tasks) instead of the process (ie their overly complicated workflow and terrible UI)
I understand the complexity involved in managing tasks, but let's agree that "no" software does it better, everyone have some advantage and disadvantages over one another.
But when you are in BIG team that's spread over 3 different CONTINENTS, you need something to manage your task and then the process eats up your time rather that the work itself.
But you know that.
You have one thing to manage you task and other thing to keep track on developers daily tasks and for his billing, and them something else for code review tracking and something for you source control.
this is even more complex than the most complex net to entangled threads.
That' where TFS Kicks in, it has everything in it. you don't even have to leave the VS. code review, tasks, work items, User stories hell it even has the track of which line was added for which code review and the reviewer with his comment, what method what changed by how many people and for what all reasons.
This makes it easy, all the info in available at one place.
That's what I like about TFS, but unfortunately I do not know what real benefits are we getting from ClearCase over TFS.
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Surely if your team is spread geographically like this you should be looking into a distributed version control system. This is one of the reasons we're looking into ditching TFS and going with Git / Github.
"There are two ways of constructing a software design: One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies, and the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult." - C.A.R. Hoare
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Dominic Burford wrote: going with Git / Github.
Wise decision.
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Ok, so TFS is not so good with huge team and different servers?
I don't know I am asking, because that's what I need to do, choose a proper source control system.
Have you ever used ClearQuest?
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If you want a DVCS tool then you should in be considering TFS. Git is by far your best option.
"There are two ways of constructing a software design: One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies, and the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult." - C.A.R. Hoare
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Chris Maunder wrote: t feels like the process of doing sprints and cards and backlogs and burndowns and everything else in the various templates that are offered have completely taken priority over actually - y'know - managing your tasks.
That's probably because you selected the Scrum or Agile project template. You may want to choose CMMI instead for more traditional (a la Excel) tracking. See this[^] link. Don't give up on TFS - it's pretty powerful, imho!
/ravi
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Chris Maunder wrote: and terrible UI
What UI would that be? I use the Web UI for Tasks. It has its problems of course, but it does what it needs to.
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Have you had a look at Trello?
It's the virtual version of sticky notes on a whiteboard. Perfect for kanban or scrum boards, also works with your phone.
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Jörgen Andersson wrote: It's the virtual version of sticky notes on a whiteboard
Yes and it made me want to scream.
Scrum boards are great when you need to focus on a small number of items for a given sprint.
I need to manage a LOT of items across many different business units, and some of them are long (up to 2 years long) projects. I need to keep a list, somewhere, of everything we're involved in with the ability to expand/shrink my temporal focus. What are the 3 projects we'll do this quarter? What top 3 things each department has on their plate this week? Where's out TODO list and what's item #582?
cheers
Chris Maunder
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With those demands I wonder if you'll ever find something that will satisfy you.
I'm having an idea though that I might throw at you, problem is that I'll never find time to do it I'm afraid.
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That's why we wrote Tasks 
(I'm still thinking of resurrecting it!)
cheers
Chris Maunder
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