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I've been steeped in Microsoft development since my first PC in the late 1980's. And I have not investigated Apple since the Apple ][e came out.
How does Apple spying compare to Microsoft spying? (More, less or the same?)
I'm trying to establish whether my Sister will gain any privacy by switching to a Mac.
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
modified 6-Jul-24 16:46pm.
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I'm not a Mac user (although I own a Gen 5 circa 2010 iPod Nano that I like very much because it offers gapless playback) but it seems you can use a Mac without having to tie it to an Apple ID. But by doing that you won't be able to:
- download apps from the Mac App Store
- use iCloud services (like iCloud Drive, iCloud Photos, etc.)
- sync data across Apple devices
- use Apple Music or access your previous iTunes purchases
- use services like FaceTime, iMessage, or Apple Books
- get software updates through the App Store (you can still get macOS updates through System Preferences
If you're a dev, I expect you'll need an Apple ID in order to use Xcode but am not sure.
/ravi
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Is it possible to purchase Mac application software from third parties?
Don't tell me that the only place to get applications is from the Apple app store?
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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I doubt it. Methinks one would be forced to buy them from the App Store.
So unlike the MS Windows ecosystem where there are large numbers of freeware, freemium and commercial apps that don't require you to buy them from the Microsoft Store.
/ravi
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Richard Andrew x64 wrote: Don't tell me that the only place to get applications is from the Apple app store?
The EU has been after Apple for years because of that. Moreso on the phone/tablet/watch than the Mac, perhaps, but it's my understanding they're locking down the Mac more and more with each new version, not the other way around.
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Yes, it is. We use non Apple software on the Mac in our theatre. Fully supported.
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I love my nano... probably one of the sexiest devices Apple has brought to market. When I'm hiking, I would MUCH rather have a nano than a mother flucking E$%$#^%^&$^#RE heavy, pull my shorts down, etc cell phone.
I suppose there might be newer alternatives out there....
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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I think it's best to assume that all of these megacorps are sphincters in bed with the NSA.
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I guess a lot depends on the meaning of the word "spying". Are you talking about them accessing data on your machine without your permission? I don't have any proof that any of them do that. Are you talking about them knowing some personal information about you? Yes, they both do that.
In my particular case, it would be impossible for them not to know anything about me as they both send me invoices for services and they take money from my credit card. Do I mind? No, not really. Apple knows my tastes in music and Apple Music proposes a lot of songs based on my preferences. I also like to store stuff on Microsoft OneDrive so I can access it from anywhere. I use many services and companies providing those services have access to some private information. I prefer to think they don't use that information for nefarious purposes.
Mircea
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I think in the grand scheme of things apple will mine your data, but not like Microsoft, Linkedin or google. That said, there is a dark side to apple... darth vader level. Hear my sad story....
so, a few years ago, I started to dabble in Apple stuff. I gave in to the family and signed up for a family plan that gave us "free" apple iphones. Now I honestly don't give a flying elephant about the phone. The camera is useful (I'm from the era where we just don't take an infinite number of pictures of everything) other than that, I get maybe 10 real calls a month and about a 1000 spam.
Next up, I started tinkering with a virtual machine running macOS. This is called a hackintosh, but it's okay, I bought a miniMac to play with as well. The problem is that ALL of these devices Apple coordinates with... so about a year ago, Apple tried to update or backup or attempt to do something useful on my phone. My iPhone is an 11xr - old yes but perfectly functional. Whatever apple did, the phone lost 95% of my contacts. Then Apple synced, and my VM and minimac lost all of the contacts...
helpful like a chainsaw.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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Richard Andrew x64 wrote: How does Apple spying compare to Microsoft spying? (More, less or the same?)
Consider every Apple device owner has an Apple Advertising ID. They have a rather large advertising business unit. The difference is that Apple's Reality Distortion Field(tm) makes most of their customer base deny there are such things. Now watch the fanbois come out of the woodwork to somehow "correct" me here...
And yes, I am conflating advertising with spying. You can't do the former effectively without the latter. To me they're one and the same. Whether they're reselling collected data to third parties or not is immaterial to me--it's the fact that it's being collected at all I object to.
"Everybody does it" is no excuse. We used to be able to buy computers where the only piece of data that got back to the manufacturer came from the registration card, that you could choose whether to fill yourself or not.
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Thanks for that perspective!
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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Now, if any of you know me here, there is one issue that just burns me. Microsoft forced updates rebooting **** for seriously stupid reasons. I think that decision deserves a baseball bat to the knees of the person who made that decision. But wait, maybe it was made by committee. Fine, more baseball bats and I'll start a lottery of who wants to whack a knee.
Why do I bring this up now? Well, I'm trying to stage a virtual machine for my customer before I disappear into the retirement cloud. I'm clicking on Windows Update. It will not install. It won't download. I've been at this for 4 hours. Grrrr.
Elephanting clowns.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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[Some general, deep in the bowels of the Pentagon]
Nuke Redmond; It's the only way!
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
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I wish, but the Pentagon, in an infinite amount of stupidity has pushed their stuff to the cloud being assured it was secure.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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No worries. The cloud operators were undoubtedly certified for compliance with a 1000-page manual of DoD HW, SW, and operational requirements that guarantee the security of any system.
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and there you go.
Back in the 80s, I was "involved" in the area of secure operating systems. At the time, the point behind a secure OS was user a, b, and c are authorized to access project a, b and c. There should be no way, user b should see what a is working on, etc. We're talking deep down in the kernel. There was NO network access. Period. We started having to epoxy USB slots to prevent the clowns from doing seriously stupid stuff. Fast forward to Desert Storm, and the USNAVY had to ban cellphones. The sailors were talking pictures of the sky not realizing the pictures were geocoded. Basically, if you farmed facebook, you could easily track fleet movements.
But wait, it gets better. When the US went into Afghanistan and then later Iraq, the drone footage was being streamed over an unencrypted internet connection. The bad guys were watching it faster than our operators. We figured this out when the drone would fly over a group of them, and they would scatter. The drone that crashed gently in Iran? Hacked.
Putting classified data in the cloud from the clowns from Microsoft? Just blow your brains out now.
Let me clarify, so that I don't seem too harsh as clowns seem to be multiplying. Basing ANYTHING secure on a Microsoft OS is simply doomed. The core OS is hopelessly open. Now we inject the bean counters in the DoD or any other government agency... Microsoft - and if anyone from Microsoft wants to chime in - limits it's liability to what the contract says. The problem is, your bug gets people dead right there.
If you want a secure cloud environment, design it and staff it with people who understand that this stuff is life and death. I'm certain their are people at MS or Amazon that get this, I am dubious about management.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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Managers never get it, they just want the fastest and the cheapest, usually to justify their existence to their manager and then up the chain it goes. Project managers are even worse still because it all has to fit in their gantt chart and then, at the bottom of the pile, are scrum masters. More often than not, none of them have done any development work so they don't understand it nor know what's involved. None of them want to hear, "to implement this properly will take us 6-12 months" they just suggest we have 3 months.
I envy you that you are in a position to retire.
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We should have stuck with OS/2 
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Wow. A true story about Russians?! 
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I'm so sorry to hear of your retirement. I guess that means you won't be spending as much time around here, then 
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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 not quite. but you bless me with your comment. At my retirement party with my main customer, I had many people come up to me and express their appreciation for my teaching attitude. I homeschooled 11 children, so I guess it carried over. I even had the opportunity to apologize to a co-worker when in a meeting I seriously shoved my foot in my mouth..
This will side track my rant, but I'm wrapping up one customer, and I still have one on the hook until the end of the year. Been working on this retirement project a couple of years. What blindsided me was my wife indicating she was about done as well and in-laws in their late 80s. So, after my 3 month sabbatical and marrying off my last daughter, I suspect I'll be back in the ring.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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charlieg wrote: Been working on this retirement project a couple of years.
Do you mean you're making a big push at the end to maximize earnings?
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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No. Sort of... I sort of blundered into this retirement thing. I just turned 65, and over the last couple of years I've had some health issues. It makes you re-evaluate your priorities. I'm not dead yet . Going to work up an article on this - my first ever.
As for your specific question - the time to push is not at the end. Unless you have royalties or some such thing.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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