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i said many times! i like .NET and microsoft ,But as you said yourself ! .NET is a product to help us to make our product simply! and if i make a combobox, i compile it as DLL , and will use it on my next projects!
its deifference with .net is, I MADE MY OWN Control AND i will use my own ! actually after making it , i know how make it , so its will increase my programming skill ! (ofcourse we can read many Articles but discovering by ourselves has another taste)
exactly ! anyone can have his/her own! i am not judging this ! if every beginner accustom to use ready codes, so next races of programmers are too lazy , and become far from real programming! i scare in next versions of .NET , we use wizards to make anythings!
actually .NET is a gift to making money! and i like it! if i code for fun, i try to write more codes!
You simply are not smart enough to write that code properly, then you have to rewrite it so many times again and again. If you were smart enough, you could simply write that code once and you wouldn't need to use .NET, C# or Java or whatever imaginary fancy language or interface is available. If you prefer their code against yours then your code is not good enough and I don't think I could rely in your opinion as you are talking bad things about your own code.
.NET only provides a lot of general functionality that is only required when the programmer is inexperienced or simply can't learn more than he already knows. For experienced programmers, .NET it's a pile of creeps as it just adds unnecessary complexity, unacceptable process overhead, portability issues, management issues, higher costs, slower development times for high-end applications and a lot more of inconvenients that you won't have if you work with standard or native languages and write your own functions optimized for the job required.
But hey, of course most people will want .NET, because most people is not an expert. If experts were majority among programmers, these kind of discussions wouldn't exist
You know, I agree with this, but I think that therein lies a problem somewhat. For folks that have coded low level grunt work stuff lots and lots, this is really nice and is a huge help because it lets you spend your valuable time on more productive things.
What about, though, people that are just starting out? By not having to do the low level stuff, they miss out on learning the foundational things that the experienced people learned cold through repetition. It seems like there's the potential for newer people to miss out on valuable experience. Before too long you get people that can do quite a bit of things with the language, yet they are confused about the difference between value types and reference types or some other foundational skill. What do you guys think?
I can't say that you are wrong: I think people should have to do the basics first, perhaps learn to code in assembler on bare hardware, and work their way up to higher level languages so that they do know the basics.
Computing is now a relatively "mature" field. If you look at other mature professions, they don't start with first principles either. A car designer doesn't get a blank sheet of paper and have to reinvent the ball bearing before he can start work on thinking up how to get fuel into an engine without using a carb or fuel injection. Instead, they buy in that technology from companies who specialise in that field. Doctors don't mix their own medicines - they let pharmaceutical companies do years of research, then tell them what tablet does what to whom. Bakers don't grow their own wheat, mill it, and make bread - they get farmers to do the mucky bits.
I think the problem is that we aren't quite in a mature enough profession - we haven't decided how low everybody needs to know and what we can afford to "farm out" yet. But we are moving into an era when the general "jobbing" programmer knows only the high level stuff, and "experts" who know what is going on beneath that are a rare breed. Pity.
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I appreciate the feeling. .Net is fine for write-today run-it-tomorrow then throw-it-away software but I wouldn't want to use it for anything 'serious'. Not that the there's anything wrong with the codebase, it's just that the best programmers are control freaks and having your code entirely based on and wrapped up in closed-source or semi-open-source code that somebody else controls, never feels good. It's the same with Java, all great stuff but why didn't they just ship the whole runtime as a class library I can use in the way I choose? Why make me write in Java to use it when it was originally written in C/C++ anyway? The answer is of course they're control freaks too and want to make me do it their way. With Microsoft its all about saving developer support costs. If they don't let you write code that crashes they can't get a bad rep from bad apps written by people who don't know waht they're doing who then cost them a fortune in support aswell. That's what .Net was for and it does a great job. Thanks very much Microsoft but I don't need it.
"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage."
Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)
Not so long ago I have been told here that we will be 'left behind' if we don't want to 'embrace' Win 8. What a joke. From a company's perspective there may not be anything better than a large herd of sheep who faithfully runs in the direction they point.
So you are also one of the black sheep who don't mind being 'left behind'? The sort that likes to use its horns to ram obstacles out of the way instead of letting some tool or gadget do it Mickeysoft's (or anybody else's) 'right way'?
I have been thinking that for almost 35 years. On my little computer back then the normal way to write a program was machine language. Simple assemblers were available, but took away too much of your little memory.
Or you could expand the memory and run Tiny BASIC, or a 'full' BASIC if you got yourself even more RAM. I always stayed on the low level side and got better results with less hardware and at a smaller price.
Just because we have far stronger processors and much more memory now, that's no reason to get wasteful. And, what's worse, we have been isolated from what the compiler actually makes out of our source code. Often enough I have seen people do crazy things, totally unaware that memory still is limited and that even the strongest processor has no chance against brute force approaches. And I have also seen how helpless they can become when one of their 'silver bullets' fails.
I never claimed that. I just pointed out that it has not been around for 35 years. And I do not like .NET myself, it has however teached me a lot about coding structures. I could step onto Java any time I want right now, C++ too. I think .NET is a good way to get started in coding. That however, is my opinion.
I think .NET is a good way to get started in coding.
i am agree but just start with it .
for being professional must drown into programming and reconize what is going on into your .net classes! i think is better to understand anything instead of just knowing how use it!
In the end programming is programming - meaning you can be as sloppy in assembler as you can be in .Net or you can write beautiful code.
.Net just helps me organise my ideas and work, because it is object oriented its does a lot of the hard work for me.
For example I can define a form in a SQL Server database and then write a class that reads the definition and displays the form to the user so that I can administer the forms from a SQL Server database.
I can also limit what the users can access in the .Net application by defining all of this again in a SQL Server database. At the SQL Server end I don't even need to be aware of the intricacies of the .Net applications accessing it - I think this is amazing.
My first computer having been a 48K ZX Spectrum I have nothing but admiration for how easy Microsoft have made my life and how fast I can create working applications for users(sure the .Net framework could be improved but it suits my needs).
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
I used to think .NET was a good thing, but the number of versions plus the updates to fix holes in the framework is ridiculous. That, and the fact Windows OS is becoming less and less relevant these days.
It's iOS / Android / Linux where the cool stuff happens.
There's nothing wrong with C# or F# per se, just that they're being driven by Microsoft and that's the real problem. As one poster has already stated, it's just being used to continue/promote use of their products.
On the contrary, Dotnet has improved my productivity. If I'm asked to complete something called A that needs to tell B via C I want to do that without faffing around doing minute coding tasks that don't really add anything but complexity. Don't get me wrong, I've done embedded development where register mapping and page boundaries were essential considerations. I'd still love to do that kind of work again but I'll use what's right for the task. If I can do in one line what I'd previously had to do in ten, then give me one line. Just because you like to do soemthing in ten doesn't mean you're smarter than the next bloke.
Given the chance I'd rather work smart than work hard.
"I do not have to forgive my enemies, I have had them all shot." — Ramón Maria Narváez (1800-68).
"I don't need to shoot my enemies, I don't have any." - Me (2012).
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