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Hmm...
That message took a ridiculously long time to post.
It must be tea-break at the n-s-a HQ.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I thought for one moment you were going to link to last weeks Oglaf with the same subject - which was (as usual) NSW ... 
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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OriginalGriff wrote: Oglaf
What's an OGLAF?
OGLy As F*ck?
I only have a signature in order to let @DalekDave follow my posts.
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It's a cartoon strip. But ... do not, at work, search for it: it is frequently VVNSFWAT1 and should probably not be read by anyone without a mind broad enough to be tied in a bow under your chin.
Can be very funny - but is nearly always very rude.
1: very, very NSFW at all
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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OriginalGriff wrote: it is frequently VVNSFWAT1 and should probably not be read by anyone without a mind broad enough to be tied in a bow under your chin.
Sounds like my kind of humor.
I only have a signature in order to let @DalekDave follow my posts.
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Just add ".com" to the end.
This weeks is pretty tame...
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Just installed Visual Studio 2017 in an effort to examine Xamarin for building apps for deployment everywhere.
1. First thing i notice is that *I can choose a Xamarin app for Android OR iOS? That is confusing to me. I just want to build a Xamarin app that runs everywhere, right?
*EDIT -- Figured this out -- Didn't see this type of project before - it's called Cross-Platform and it's under another section on the Project Template area.
2. Next thing that happens is that Visual Studio 2017 gives me an error when it attempts to run my first app from the Xamarin.Android template. The app builds fine, but it won't start the emulator. VS 2017 failed to add a environment variable ANDROID_SDK_ROOT -- I've documented the problem at:
xamarin - Why won't Visual Studio 2017 run Android emulator? (Gives error ANDROID_SDK_ROOT missing) - Stack Overflow[^]
3. After fixing that, I add two simple controls (Button and EditText) and try to run again. Now the controls will not show up in the app, even though they render properly in the VS 2017 design window.
I've posted a question at:
android layout - In visual studio 2017, why won't xamarin app controls (button, editText) show up? - Stack Overflow[^]
This is the state of EASY DEVELOPMENT and
Quote: Build Once Run Everywhere
So far, I'm meh about the whole thing.
It's much easier for me to use Android Studio.
yes, I happen to be looking for miracles.
I would like to build some apps at lightning speed. It's all a dream though.
modified 7-May-17 19:08pm.
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I've been using Xamarin.Android to build Android apps using VStudio2015/C# with great success. I don't use an emulator, but debug on a physical device (Google Nexus). I find this to be convenient and fast. Haven't yet moved to VS2017.
/ravi
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Ravi Bhavnani wrote: I don't use an emulator, but debug on a physical device (Google Nexus).
That's probably the best option really.
Lately, I've also ran Android Studio from a VM and then I use Genymotion [^] Amazon Web Service which runs android emulators in your browser. YOu just drag/drop your APK on the emulator running in the browser window and it works quite well and amazingly fast.
It was kind of a pain to set up though, but interesting.
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I found that Xamarin was occasionally a pain to install and/or configure.
And VS2017 continue the tradition with a disappointing install experience.
However, once you get it going, it's all good! 
My biggest gripe with Xamarin on VS2017 is that it does NOT come with VS Android Emulator.
And one has to go through some hoops to use it...
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Super Lloyd wrote: However, once you get it going, it's all good!
That's good to hear.
I guess I had issues with AndroidStudio in the beginning too.
I was also fortunate because running the Android emulator is always a pain and I am happy to say that VStudio 2017 seems to find the Android SDK and use the same emulator and images so no double-install.
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raddevus wrote:
I would like to build some apps at lightning speed. It's all a dream though.
Is your lightning cable installed?
"One man's wage rise is another man's price increase." - Harold Wilson
"Fireproof doesn't mean the fire will never come. It means when the fire comes that you will be able to withstand it." - Michael Simmons
"You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him." - James D. Miles
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Interesting. I'm going through the same pain and am actually thinking of just switching to native app development. It seems like a whole lot of loops to jump through that, frankly, shouldn't be there.
cheers
Chris Maunder
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I find this surprising. I've been doing Xamarin development for a while now and don't see any of these issues. The problem most people have is that they rely on the native Android emulator; this is a slow beast and you're much better off using the x86 emulator.
This space for rent
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It wasn't the emulator that was an issue (and to be honest I didn't see a huge difference between the Android one in 2015 and the MS one in 2017 - though I barely used them).
The main issue was that things simply didn't build. I would fire up VS 2015, create a new project from their templates, and they would not even compile.
I had some other issues[^] with iOS, and the Android part seemed a long series of installing 50 SDKs all named the same without any real guidance on what was actually needed. 40Gb later and that seemed to sort itself out.
I do not have my head wrapped around Xamarin forms even vaguely at this point, and the demo apps I've tried (mainly involving bluetooth) just don't work.
My wild guesses as to the issues
- Android moves quickly and keeping up with requirements makes life hard for Xamarin, hence the shotgun approach.
- Xamarin tries to use what the other vendors provide meaning they can't provide a neat, integrated "we'll set this all up for you" experience
- Dealing with XCode is just going to be painful. I'm sure that's not by mistake
- The native iOS/Android community has way more mature and stable examples than the Xamarin community. It's just the nature of the beast
So I'm heading to native so that
a) I can just get started
b) I can lean on lots of existing code samples
c) I can understand what's actually happening before I abstract it all using Xamarin
cheers
Chris Maunder
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Maybe it's because I've used XAML for years now that I find Xamarin Forms simple to grok. I have started on an unofficial Code Project app, using Forms, that I will be writing an article about. It is the final part of the CP API series I started before, and brings the various parts together. Hopefully that will help you to grok how Forms works by the end; along with how to drop back to platform specific when necessary.
This space for rent
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Chris Maunder wrote: I'm going through the same pain and am actually thinking of just switching to native app development.
That's exactly why I was trying out VS 2017...to see if the dream is true -- write once, run anywhere.
I've done native Android and iOS apps and each are painful in their own way but unless VS 2017 / Xamarin can really allow me to build apps with the same power then jumping through hoops to create them there doesn't get me much.
I feel like I might get to a place with Xamarin where there is functionality that I'd need to customize anyways. However, once I got it to build in VS 2017 and run properly, it was enticing.
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First things first... It's a write once (almost) run everywhere solution (you have to build for each platform, it is only hidden from you by the environment).
Do you have web development experience? If so, you may try Cordova...
Skipper: We'll fix it.
Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this?
Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
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Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter wrote: Do you have web development experience? If so, you may try Cordova..
I do and thanks for mentioning that.
I was mostly checking out VS 2017 to see how smooth it all works for creating apps across platforms.
In most cases I find that there are just a lot of hoops to jump through.
At some point, I just think, well just write the app natively on each if this "write once, run everywhere" thing has so much to customize anyways.
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FWIW my employer does a fair amount of Xamarin. They've told me that the pure runs everywhere Xamarin.Forms UI library is too limited in its ability to customize how UI controls look and function to be useful in anything but the narrowest cases. Instead what my coworkers do is build a shared backend with all the business logic (and a data layer shared with the server if it's done in .net); and then build separate nativish UIs using Xamarin.IOS and Xamarin.Android (C# wrappers of the platforms native components).
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, waging all things in the balance of reason?
Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful?
--Zachris Topelius
Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies.
-- Sarah Hoyt
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Very interesting and that is why I was examining how Xamarin really works also.
Again, there are still hoops to jump through. I know that is basically always the case with multi-platform, but again I was just dreaming.
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I feel your pain! I've tried to Xamarin Forms for years, but it never worked until VS2017, but worked is somewhat a misnomer.
- The connection between building, running and the emulator is so strange that it too a long time before I figured out how to effectively make this process work consistently. I simply run the emulator first before ever trying to debug and I get better results, but it's still very slow.
- Watch out where you have your project. They seem to document this nowhere, but I moved a project and it never generated the debug(mdb) file after the move. I looked everywhere with no luck, only to find a post about it having path problems. It appears that if your path has a "$" in it, the debug file won't be generated... yikes!!!
- For some strange reason Xamarin Forms XAML decided to do things differently from Microsoft XAML, go figure. For instance, instead of StackPanel, they use Stack Layout, but that's the least of the offenses, so watch out.
Other than that, I've been able to finally develop in a consistent fashion and am now just trying new things in an attempt to jump start the development of my first mobile app.
Good Luck!
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Thanks for chiming in.
Great info. I will watch for those things.
I was thinking about it today and there are so many differences between iOS and Android (my two main concerns) that it probably doesn't matter anyways.
Here are a couple of examples of what I mean.
Recently I wrote an app that receives SMS text messages and uses Text-To-Speech (TTS) to read them to you (Android).
Android Phone Reads SMS (Txt) Messages To You[^]
However, you cannot get received SMS messages like that on iOS anyways.
Also TTS is completely different on iOS. So that app is out.
Also, the app I originally wrote on all 4 (Windows, Web, Android, iOS) platforms the old way uses some interesting Canvas type of elements that are not going to be handled by Xamarin.
C'YaPass - Android @ Play[^]
CYaPass on the App Store[^]
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