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Quote: think the game designers should bear some responsibility here as well...
Not disagreeing, but...
Quote: Katie Phillips' daughter reset security settings to accept her own fingerprint to make purchases
I believe some one else has more responsibility.
Assuming this simply isn't just the parents bullshitting.
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Don't get me wrong - the daughter is the primary culprit, and her mother deserves blame as well.
But Roblox is designed for kids, and it's at best unethical to allow them to do that. If gambling is "restricted" with gambling companies required to warn people if they are spending too much too quickly (and they are in the UK at least though it's as useful as a chocolate teapot) then allowing kids to generate that kind of debt is a disgusting practice IMO.
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
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I was actually referring to a certain fruit company in this case.
Having so bad security that the daughter could change the fingerprint for appstore is remarkable, imao.
On that other system I have Family link installed. Any time my kids try to install something that costs money, I have to ok it. On my own phone.
I also get the possibility to limit the time spent on these gadgets, and I can easily block apps I don't agree with. On distance.
The kids learn quickly and don't click anything that's an In app purchase.
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You don't mean ... iPurchases iGive iPercentage iTo iCompany iSo iThey iDon't iCare ... iSurely iNot!
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
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OriginalGriff wrote: You don't mean ...
Actually...
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But ...
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
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Jörgen Andersson wrote: Having so bad security that the daughter could change the fingerprint for appstore is remarkable, imao.
I didn't think it was possible. Any changes to verification methods/details require entry of the password.
There may be more to this than Mum is telling.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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There certainly can be. That's why I added the sentence about the mother bullshitting in my first answer.
I'm going to test it on my wifes fruitphone tonight.
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Checked it during lunch on a coworkers phone.
If you setup your phone to use TouchID you need to enter your passcode to add fingerprints on your phone.
You can then allow TouchID to authorize Appstore. For that you need to authenticate once using your AppleID.
If you later decide to add another fingerprint to the TouchID service you only need to authenticate yourself using your Passcode. You don't need to authenticate yourself using your AppleID.
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So the girl could have done it.
I'd call that a poorly-thought-out security process, and can't help but wonder how many other children have managed to buy stuff without their parents knowing.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Having seen the way my 3-year old grandson plays with any family member's mobile phone, and in the past my granddaughter on some Disney online game, I totally agree. Children have no idea what's going on in these devices, or the costs associated with them.
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"255" ... almost sounds like bot work.
It was only in wine that he laid down no limit for himself, but he did not allow himself to be confused by it.
― Confucian Analects: Rules of Confucius about his food
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Forgive me in advance for being a ludite.
Quote: after her eight-year-old daughter
Eight year old's should not have an iPad, iPhone, etc etc etc. In my ludite strong opinion, anyone under 13 shouldn't.
They should be out playing, or reading, or doing something that properly develops their minds and souls. For those of you old enough, I'm sure you can remember occupying yourself with all sorts of fun things that didn't involve staring mindlessly at a screen and clicking on things with your thumbs.
The fault here lies in the broader scope of our society in general and the bullshit that we call social media, entertainment, and so forth, that we have been led to believe is good for our children and has some actual value as an adult.
And don't give me this bullshit that they need a head start in today's world. I didn't touch a computer until 7th grade, and it was a teletype machine that saved programs to tape - punch tape!!!
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I am from the generation who went outside to play.
Hated it!
Luckily I had my own NES back then, and a little later I got my own PC with games such as Age of Empires and The Curse of Monkey Island 
I had friends who had limited computer time, like an hour or two a day, I never understood why.
I have a cousin who is the same, but his sister still likes to go outside.
Maybe the "problem" is that not everyone likes to go outside and do stupid stuff like run after a ball and be social
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While I agree with your overall sentiment that nobody under 13 should have an iDevice, need I remind anyone that the previous generation was also accused of using television as a babysitter. Or a substitute for actual parenting.
I totally agree also with the idea that they "should be out playing". George Carlin had a whole bit about going out and playing with a stick.
But no, today, everybody still outside is a child kidnapper, a murderer or a Catholic priest.
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I understand where that comes from, and while I agree in principle, reality looks different today.
My son was the second last one to get a phone in his class, and he was always sitting at home doing nothing productive. And when asked why, it was always because he didn't know what the others were up to.
Strange answer! Right?
I finally realized that he was outside the loop.
He has a phone now, often out playing. Kids nowadays communicate using messages.
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I would suspect the parents did not set up a fingerprint authorisation and the kid only had to set a new finger print rather than change an existing one - it is still a flaw in the apple system and unconscionable actions by the app designer to accept such volume from a rugrat.
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity -
RAH
I'm old. I know stuff - JSOP
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Mycroft Holmes wrote: I would suspect the parents did not set up a fingerprint authorisation
Either that or it was a fun game, showing the girl how to use her thumb with the device.
Should be fun paying the bill, too. I don't think the digit I'd give apple would be a thumb.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Quote: Ms Phillips, 35, said: "I felt sick and was in floods of tears. ... It was hard to be too angry with her because she didn't really know what she was doing and she didn't understand.
An eight-year old who can bypass security and install her fingerprint as a new password didn't know what she was doing ?
Well, this is what happens when parents with pointy chins give an eight-year old an £300 iPad.
I fault the parents, and I fault Barclay's for not flagging such a suspicious series of purchases in a short time and notifying the parents,.
To the young lady: I think you have a very bright future, and I suspect MI6 is going to recruit you.
«One day it will have to be officially admitted that what we have christened reality is an even greater illusion than the world of dreams.» Salvador Dali
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Ah yes, modern society where nothing you do is your responsibility, everything bad that happens is the fault of someone else and everyone else has a duty to ensure you face no consequences for your actions.
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No, that's not what I'm saying.
What I'm saying is that designing games to appeal to the vulnerable - and children are that - is much the same as charging 4000% APR on a "pay day loan" designed to scrape the last vestiges of money away from the poor. It's immoral, unethical, and downright reprehensible.
Yes, the kid is to blame, as is the mother, as (perhaps) is iCompany for allowing a security flaw like that to be possible (assuming mummy is telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, which I doubt), as is the credit card company. But the developers shoulder the main blame for deliberately crafting a game to do just that.
And I thought EA was bad with their DLC model ... 
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
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OriginalGriff wrote: as (perhaps) is iCompany for allowing a security flaw like that to be possible (assuming mummy is telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, which I doubt)
Tested during lunch on a coworkers phone as explained here[^]
In short, don't allow TouchID to authorize sales on someone elses phone.
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If you're vulnerable it's the job of your protectors to keep you safe.
The protector in this case is the parent. Not the game developers.
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In the Netherlands you could challenge the sale in court; not just because the parent didn't authorize the sale, but because the sales are based on misleading the customer.
Bastard Programmer from Hell 
If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
"If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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Quote: "It was hard to be too angry with her because she didn't really know what she was doing and she didn't understand.
"We are really angry, but she is innocent. She said she thought it was free.
"She does look sorry. She looked white when we spoke to her about it and she started crying.
Oh, she looks sorry. I guess that makes it alright.
Without getting into the technical details...she managed to reset the payment settings. She must've known something or she wouldn't have done that.
Quote: Her iPad has been confiscated and she has been banned from using iTunes games as punishment.
What about paying back the money? Clearly the parents are going to have to pay back the debt, but the kid needs to pay back the amount to her parents. She's 8--she's going to need to do chores for a long, long time to come. But she shouldn't be let off the hook. (No, I don't have kids. Yes, that's exactly what I'd be doing.)
Quote: "However, we empathise with Ms Phillips' situation, so we have made arrangements not to charge any interest on the transactions.
How benevolent of the credit card company.
Quote: I thought it must have been fraud at first. But then I saw the transactions were all from Apple and I just thought 'oh my god'.
"oh my god, this confirms it is fraud".
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