Is namespace Microsoft a system-defined namespace?

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I came across the following statement made in Micosoft documentation using directive - C# Reference | Microsoft Docs[^] --> "Namespaces come in two categories: user-defined and system-defined. User-defined namespaces are namespaces defined in your code. For a list of the system-defined namespaces, see .NET API Browser."

My question is: Does "system-defined namepace" only refer to namespace `System` and any namespace defined under it? Or is namespace `Microsoft`(and any namespace defined under it) also a system-defined namespace?

I did look in the .NET API browser | Microsoft Docs[^] and yes, namespace Microsoft is in fact in shown in the .Net API browser. However, my confusion is, because "system" is a part of the term "system-defined namespace" my thoughts are that "system-defined namespace" may only be referring to namespace System and any namespace defined under namespace System. But I am unsure. Hence my question concerning namespace Microsoft. Thank in advance.

What I have tried:

.Net API browser, system-defined namespace, Microsoft, C#

Posted 6-Sep-21 20:17pm

CBennigton

Updated 6-Sep-21 21:11pm

v5

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BillWoodruff 7-Sep-21 6:05am

Why are you "spinning your wheels" with topics like semantic analysis of NameSpace terminology, when you could be leaning how to program ? There are (surprise !) numerous inconsistencies in MS docs and tutorials, most of which you can safely ignore. The people that write those docs are often technically limited, low-status, employees.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 13:25pm

Very true. I have come across my fair share of inconsistencies in docs and tutorials. Thanks for the heads up :)

BillWoodruff 7-Sep-21 19:36pm

Excellent attitude :) Let me modify my over-broad characterization of tech-writers thus: they CAN be people who have excellent language/grammar skills, good communicators.

Richard MacCutchan 8-Sep-21 12:50pm

"The people that write those docs are often technically limited, low-status, employees."
I am not sure that is true. In my experience tech writers are on a par with developers. Unless you know something specific about Microsoft.

BillWoodruff 8-Sep-21 21:20pm

Did you notice I added: "Let me modify my over-broad characterization of tech-writers thus: they CAN be people who have excellent language/grammar skills, good communicators."

BillWoodruff 8-Sep-21 21:32pm

"Unless you know something specific about Microsoft."

Raise thy Lance, Sir Knight: Castle Redmond is not under siege by this villain :)

Oh Boy, do I know specifics :)

But, assuming I didn't have many direct personal experiences as author, as editor, as end-user, over a period of years ... and, I started relying on MS Docs: I would be horrified by the mistakes, omissions, code examples that are irrelevant or broken.

Not to mention the junkyard called MSDN support forums, where any old MS employee, or wanna-be expert, can post rubbish.

"Low status" is used to refer to the perceptions of others, not as a put-down, or, an indictment.

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Richard MacCutchan · Accepted Answer · 2021-09-06T21:11:00

Solution 1

See .NET API browser | Microsoft Docs[^]

Posted 6-Sep-21 21:11pm

Richard MacCutchan

Comments

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 3:24am

I did in fact look in the .NET API browser and "yes" namespace Microsoft is in fact in shown in the .Net API browser.

However, my confusion is, because "system" is a part of the term "system-defined namespace" my thoughts are that "system-defined namespace" may only be referring to namespace System and any namespace defined under namespace System. But I am unsure. Hence my question concerning namespace Microsoft.

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 3:48am

All of the namespaces defined in the .NET API are 'system' defined. That is to say they are an integral part of the framework and contain all of the classes that make up the API.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 4:02am

"All of the namespaces defined in the .NET API are 'system' defined." --> So then I take it namespace Microsoft is in fact a "system-defined namespace"?

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 4:08am

If it is in the list then it is system defined.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 4:24am

I mean if we are being very specific here then I would say "NO, namespace Microsoft is not in the list" as shown in the lastest version of the .Net framework 4.8

I see sub-namespaces defined under namespace Microsoft such as: Microsoft.Activities.Build, Microsoft.CSharp , etc... which are found in the list, but it does not list just namespace "Microsoft" as part of the list. Thus, I am starting to think that namespace Microsoft is not a system-defined namespace. I would appreciate if you could check that out for me.

Concerning namespace System, I do see namespace System and the sub-namespaces defined under namesace System are in the list. So I have no problem there.

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 4:32am

All the namespaces that begin with "Microsoft" are system defined. Although there is no specific one that is just named "Microsoft", it is not a good idea to use that for your own purposes.

Bat I am not sure exactly what problem or issue you are trying to solve here.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 4:57am

As a final quesiton though even though "Microsoft" alone is not part of the list, in your opinion would you say it is still considered a sytem-defined namespace?

As for the question itself, i'm actually writting a paper on Namespaces and i'm trying to understand the concrete details of it. I really appreciate all the help so far.

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 5:48am

As you can see a names[pace may consist of multiple words separated by full stops. The first word is the root (or more properly the trunk), and the others are the branches. So even though there is no namespace named "Microsoft" it is effectively system defined by virtue of being the root of all the others. See also Organizing types in namespaces | Microsoft Docs[^].

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 7:37am

Take a look at Namespaces - C# language specification | Microsoft Docs[^]. It explains why Microsoft is a system defined namespace.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 13:42pm

Awesome. I have accepted your solution as the answer. As I told BillWoodruff I do believe understanding the semantics are important along with actual programming. Else why would someone bother with reading documentations, articles or video tutorials. Thanks for the help.

BillWoodruff 7-Sep-21 6:08am

+5 A great series of answers and replies !

Richard MacCutchan 7-Sep-21 6:14am

Thanks Bill, for both vote and warning.

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 13:34pm

But isn't learning the semantics the foundation of programming?

I had no idea that "The people that write those docs are often technically limited, low-status, employees." I do think every now then for someone to acknowledge the sementatics. Else documentations and online resources wouldn't exist.

BillWoodruff 7-Sep-21 19:31pm

My reply may have too "harsh:" I apologize. And, I am not really sure if you are, under a new name, repeating earlier questions: so, I should not have speculated "in public."

There's nothing wrong about wanting to understand the fundamental structure of the language, and the framework !

I will add some ideas to how I think you can most productively go about that to your other question.

But, I do think ... depending on your future goals, like being employable ... you should evaluate the extent to which you want to become an expert on minutiae, a scholar of edge cases that rarely arise in most real-world projects.

See if you find my comments on this thread relevant ...

https://www.codeproject.com/Messages/5830741/Re-I-dont-like-code-reviews

https://www.codeproject.com/Messages/5830657/Re-I-dont-like-code-reviews

CBennigton 7-Sep-21 20:49pm

You're alright. Sometimes tough love is best way to teach / give someone advice.

Once again thanks for your advice and I will absolutely read your comments on the thread you mentioned. As a final note I added a comment on the other post I made. Perhaps you can give me your insight on what I mentioned there. But all in all thanks.

Richard MacCutchan 8-Sep-21 5:38am

I had no idea that "The people that write those docs are often technically limited, low-status, employees."
I do not know where you got that idea, but you are quite wrong. The job of Technical Writer is a highly skilled one, and requires people who can turn (often obscure) code into human readable form. If you spend time reading the Microsoft technical documents you will soon see why.

CBennigton 8-Sep-21 12:46pm

Those are not my words. I was reiterating what user BillWoodruff said (See comments outside of the solution). I am sure the individuals that wrote the docs are excellent programmers but I guess not everyone feels that way.

BillWoodruff 9-Sep-21 3:01am

And, the above is your "through a glass, darkly" interpretation of my words :)

Richard MacCutchan 9-Sep-21 4:01am

No, it is a comment on CBennington's words. I was not aware when writing it that the words came from you.

BillWoodruff 9-Sep-21 5:04am

uhhh ... okay :)