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norm.net wrote: MCAD/MCSD are a farce, you don't know whether they've been achieved by legit circumstances.
The same could basically be said for just about any formal training. I've met some people with "Computer Science" degree/masters that couldn't program their way out of a paper bag.
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it shows people you might know a thing or 2 on the subject you got certified in :-b
IM PROUD TO BE A GMAIL;
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I think many programers would like to consider themselves to be flexible enough to handle any task thrown at them. You wouldn't go to a dermatologist for heart surgery, but I'd like to think that I could handle a variety of projects and not pidgeon-hole myself into one field.
Perhaps a distinction might be made between game developers and business app developers.
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I completely agree with the last part of your post...
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kryzchek wrote:
Perhaps a distinction might be made between game developers and business app developers.
That's no different than this pigeon-hole crap you're talking about.
Jeremy Falcon
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Glad to see you took your a**hole pill today.
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If that's the best reply you can come up with then you are obviously a waste of my time.
Lemme guess, the word "crap" upset you?  No don't bother with a reply because I'm done.
Jeremy Falcon
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I would prefer to keep that in the private sector. Let reputable companies and organizations (i.e. mysql) create their own certification. Industry is generally self-regulating in that respect. If someone is certified by Oracle or Microsoft, you know that they have knowledge about the system in question. If, however, someone were certified by "Joe's SQL Certifications and Pawn Shop", no one would take it seriously.
I also think that computer science education needs to be reconsidered. My undergrad degree was a four year waste of time. I probably could have learned all of that material in a year or less. Furthermore, I spent two years on general education that my high school had already taught me. Interesting new survey question: Do you have a degree and do you actually find it useful?
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Degrees are useful for imigration purposes.
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland
Colib and ilikecameras.
K(arl) wrote:
oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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So is marriage 
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Indeed. I am weighing up which is the easier route 
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland
Colib and ilikecameras.
K(arl) wrote:
oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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Paul Watson wrote: Indeed. I am weighing up which is the easier route
Get a degree, immigrate, marry a citizen, become a citizen. Isn't that an age-old trick?
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Depends what you want, citizenship or work permits. Citizenship though would be nice, but I can get that by marriage faster than by getting a degree.
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland
Colib and ilikecameras.
K(arl) wrote:
oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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Go for a degree, marrage is a one way street!
bum... and I thought I´d got rid of all the bugs 
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I have to agree with you on that. The only time I really wished I had a degree was when I considered emmigration.
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How sure are you about that? 
SkyWalker
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Very. Governments are lagging behind corporates and require degrees for immigration purposes. Without a degree you will find emmigrating a lot more difficult.
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland
Colib and ilikecameras.
K(arl) wrote:
oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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Oh, I see.
What about that: you have a very high degree, you already managed to get hired in your dream country, and after a while they tell you they do not give a penny on your degree as they do not like to pay more for more educated people?
(It's just a question concerning, let's say, imaginary characters  )
SkyWalker
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They don't do it already ?
Well you actually have to choices:
1) quit the job and find a new one
2) continue working for less money
Generally speaking degree doesn't mean a thing. Degree in anything. I can easily go and buy a bunch of diplomas if I needed to. The knowledge of that subject - now that's what matters.
--------------------------------
Human stupidity is infinite.
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It should matter! Maybe some people could find in that the answer to the "classical" question: can Europe compete against the US?
... and I agree with your ... dots
SkyWalker
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The "classical" question is really really stupid and I can give you a lot of reasons why.
But I don't agree that the actuall degree should matter. As I said it's mainly a paper which is supposed to accompony (or accomponie, forgot how it's spelled) your knowledge.
--------------------------------
Human stupidity is infinite.
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No, the question is not stupid at all.
And the paper you are talking about is normally supposed to certify your knowledge in a specific area (if it was issued in an honest way). This should be the rule, and not the exception
SkyWalker
-- modified at 8:42 Monday 12th December, 2005
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Mircea Puiu wrote: And the paper you are talking about is normally supposed to certify your knowledge in a specific area
See the text in bold 
Mircea Puiu wrote: No, the question is not stupid at all.
It is stupid just because if you'll take a look at the amount of Europeans who immigrated to the US you'll find out that there's hell lot many of 'em. And I mean the bright minds. I'll just provide an example from military industry. Sikorsky.
--------------------------------
Human stupidity is infinite.
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and what have those immigrants to the US to do with the question regarding the competition being stupid ?!
SkyWalker
-- modified at 8:49 Monday 12th December, 2005
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Maybe the fact that half of US citizens (ok, not half, exxagerating) are actually Europeans with US passports ?
--------------------------------
Human stupidity is infinite.
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