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On the other hand, if you were halfway competent, you would love having JSOP on your team!
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This.
I had a coworker who was my team leader in a project that had a very strong character. Until I gained his trust (I was the newly inserted member) it's been tough, but once I did he always had my back and the back of our teams. Most of all, if he ever took a decision because the managers or the customers wouldn't, he'd own it.
Once I was being chewed off by the customer for having implemented a certain functionality before another, my team leader entered the room, placed between us and said "I told him that priorities, got a problem with that?". Not a peep more from the customer for the remaining months.
Best team I ever worked in.
GCS d--(d+) s-/++ a C++++ U+++ P- L+@ E-- W++ N+ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t+ 5? X R+++ tv-- b+(+++) DI+++ D++ G e++ h--- r+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
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The problem is... they are so rare 
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Absolutely but I bet he doesn't suffer fools gladly.
"I didn't mention the bats - he'd see them soon enough" - Hunter S Thompson - RIP
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pkfox wrote: I wouldn't like to be the PM - especially with you working there !!!
pkfox wrote: Absolutely but I bet he doesn't suffer fools gladly.
what a disappointment... I didn't have you for a fool, but if you tell it so...    
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Steady 😊
"I didn't mention the bats - he'd see them soon enough" - Hunter S Thompson - RIP
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Any PM who kicks the can down the road deserves to be kicked in the can - talk about gathering technical debt!
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity -
RAH
I'm old. I know stuff - JSOP
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No company is perfect (especially government) and people make mistakes.
You just threw your PM under a bus and complained about him TO A CUSTOMER!
In my book that's an absolute no go.
If you have problems, run it by your manager, if they don't listen and you're dissatisfied, leave.
You're now just actively sabotaging the company from within.
We have very strict employee laws in the Netherlands and in some cases it can be almost impossible to get one fired.
I think this is one of the reasons for direct dismissal though.
An absolute dick move, no matter how much you disagree with the policy 
[Edit]
JSOP's customer was internal and everyone knew about the situation, making my reply not applicable in this case.
Consider JSOP's reputation cleared, at least from this incident
[/Edit]
modified 10-Mar-21 5:27am.
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In view of JSOP's job, the customer may well be in the same employ as JSOP's 'company'.
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That would at least make it a whole lot less bad.
That would basically be complaining to coworkers, which is a little like teambuilding
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Although I do agree with you on this, John is getting ready to retire here soon (I think) and I am pretty sure that he does not give an elephant about tactics and niceties anymore (always?).
I could be wrong.
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That's really not an excuse for causing harm to the company you work for.
If anything, it's a reason to keep him far away from customers.
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I work for the US government. You can't hurt the government. BTW, my boss backed me up on that email.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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Sander Rossel wrote: If anything, it's a reason to keep him far away from customers.
To me that'd be the end-goal.
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You are not wrong. 
Even when I was younger, my was honest to a fault. I actually got let go a couple of times because of it. Such is life, but at least i didn't sacrifice what I believed in. My principles are fully intact.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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0) I tried for a month to get to get the account back.
1) My boss tried for a month to get the account back.
2) We warned the customer (sits in the next room) that support would have to come from the DBAs and told them why.
3) A problem comes up, and I reminded everyone we've been trying to get the account back for a month.
4) Everybody already knew what was going on.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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#realJSOP wrote: 2) We warned the customer (sits in the next room)
#realJSOP wrote: 4) Everybody already knew what was going on.
Those are important details you didn't mention!
Complaining to customers is a sin punishable by dismissal.
Complaining to coworkers is basically teambuilding 
And yeah, I get that coworkers may be customers (even paying ones), but still coworkers too.
Your place sounds awful to work for by the way 
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Sander Rossel wrote: Those are important details you didn't mention!
Well, it wasn't necessary until people started making assumptions. 
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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9/10 times it's safe to assume "a customer" is not someone in the office next to you 
I apologize to the 1/10.
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That makes me the 2/10. My customers are other departments within the company and in occasions even within my division.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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2/20, you're part of the next 10
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Sander Rossel wrote: Your place sounds awful to work for by the way
A couple of the guys (the PM is one) are hard to work with, but the work itself is kinda fun.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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I once left a 30-person company for one person.
The person was part of my team and he was so toxic I didn't want to spend another day with that a**hole.
Another person left a few months later for the same reason.
I've worked at another company like that, although it was a lot smaller with only seven people, but it was quite doable to avoid the toxic person.
I can imagine your job has some cool challenges and it's probably a good place to work.
Always a bummer when one or two guys ruin the atmosphere.
Good luck with those guys, maybe send out a couple more frustrated emails? You have my blessing
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The way I see it is that I retire in 3 years, an I have no doubt I can return their fire for that long.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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