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Yes, you do know. Shame we don't listen to you.
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Mar
second S
vehicle CAR SCAR
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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ya 
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Dunno if that was simpler than most, or I just got it right away. Good one though!
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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I seemed to have screwed up BOTH Win7 VMs, so I decided to start over.
On my dekstop, I was smart enough to have made a snapshot of the VM aftr getting the VM working with the display, USB3 and networking, before installing any dev tools. This allowed me to delete the snapshot and create a new one, and only have to install the dev tools again.
The loaptop was a different story, and I had to delete the entire vm and start from scratch. I'm finally at the point that I can start installing dev tools again.
What a crappy kind of weekend...
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
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Quote: I'm finally at the point that I can start installing dev tools again
How about starting the installation by a story...
0. Grab bottle of Shiner.
1. Walk in to your desk.
2. Open your laptop.
3. Turn on the power.
4. Google and download the tools.
5.More stories...
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I've keep a few VM's in different stages.
First one is base OS with basic utils and settings the way I like, then take a snapshot
clone that (after snapshot) and add dev utils, database tools, libs (but not the databases), snap shot
clone that, install & pref-set visual studio, snapshot
clone that, snapshot, add local databases, snapshot, do work, occasional snapshots (so backup only needs the last snapshot file)
the last [pre-clone] snapshot on each machine, (particularly the first one), provides for testing on a fully clean settings (untainted by something quick-modded during dev/app install and not recorded in the installer script/notes, i.e. reg setting/dll often overlooked) and fully clean/restore it after for the next time.
... if say added some garbage extension/setting to vs, can snap back to the clean vs
... if say database upgrades, can test the upgrade. if wanted few months later roll back snaps/clones and re-build "new machines" using it as the base version.
lately moving from vs17 to 19: cloned pre-vs and installed/pref set 19 - fully clean, no 17 baggage issues
(and just in case of problems kept the vs17 ones around till I was sure I could ditch them.)
think like those guys like linus on youtube when they test soft/hardware: they have a store room of different machines to pick from - some clean/re-cleaned, some [part] modded, some old, some different o/s....)
Message Signature
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Okay, that was an analogy.
I was trying a little piece of Python code. Got a bit surprised with the "positional"-indentation requirements in code. Just like how it used to be in older programming languages like Cobol. (I'm not sure if any other recent programming languages enforce these)
For example,
If x is a:
do
is different from
if x is a:
do
It's funny, and doesn't this sound rudimentary and a bit annoying? 
modified 13-Jul-19 12:00pm.
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The first version will not work as it has a syntax error. It should be:
if x is a:
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fixed ! Thanks
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It sorta makes sense, and in theory at least should encourage correct indentation.
But ... that won't save it. Survey Results - If you know C, C++, C#, Objective C or Java do you also know Python?[^]
Just the "no need to declare variables" sends a shiver down my spine. That's actually worse than VB could manage - and that takes some doing!
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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OriginalGriff wrote: "no need to declare variables" sends a shiver down my spine.
Er, isn't that exactly why the "var" keyword was invented? A few years from now no one will be using proper typed variables any more.
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Oh, no, no, no, no!
Python's version is worse: you don't need to declare the variable using "var", or "Dim", or anything - just pick a name and assign a value. So if you misspell it ... that's a new variable.
Just like FORTRAN was back in the day (1977). And that caused a probe to miss the planet Venus completely, so what it does in a banking app, or a Boeing 737 Max is not something you want to think about too hard, really.
Strongly typed variables should be mandatory in all languages used in the 21st century!
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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OriginalGriff wrote: Python's version is worse
I agree, but you can still do quite a bit of damage with var.
OriginalGriff wrote: Strongly typed variables should be mandatory in all languages used in the 21st century!
That is definitely true; but will teachers explain that properly to their students?
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Richard MacCutchan wrote: I agree, but you can still do quite a bit of damage with var.
In what language?
JavaScript? Certainly, but JavaScript doesn't really get much better than that...
In C# it's still a typed variable, so it's exactly the same thing as explicitly using the type name except instead of the type name you use var. So no damage there, except to readability.
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C#
var elapsedTime = stopwatch.ElapsedMilliseconds;
var processedCount = GetProcessedCount();
var processedPerSecond = processedCount / elapsedTime * 1000;
Spot the bug.
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Fueled By Caffeine wrote: var processedPerSecond = processedCount / elapsedTime * 1000;
Probably there, you get an int instead of a decimal?
However, changing var to decimal will still result in a wrong output as an int is silently cast to a decimal, but that doesn't change outcome of the divide operation.
The fix I think you're looking for is:
var processedPerSecond = (decimal)processedCount / elapsedTime * 1000; Now here is a fun bug, which I've seen go wrong multiple times...
var query = databaseContext.SomeTable;
query = query.Where(x => x.SomeBoolLimitingTheResultFromThousandsToTens);
return query.ToList(); In this piece of code the query variable is of type IQueryable.
That means the Where that is executed is actually Queryable.Where(IQueryable, Expression).
The actual database call, with WHERE clause, is executed on the ToList method (or more precise, in the Enumerator).
Now someone comes and changes the code, the first line becomes var query = databaseContext.SomeTable.ToList();
Suddenly, the type of query has changed to IEnumerable!
The database query WITHOUT the WHERE clause is executed and Enumerable.Where(IEnumerable, Func) is executed to filter the collection in-memory.
You now get thousands of records instead of tens, while the in-memory Where is probably more expensive than the database WHERE.
All in all a nice performance hit...
That is actually the only bug I've ever encountered while working with var, and it's pretty specific.
And the only reason it goes wrong is because IQueryable and IEnumerable have pretty much the same extension methods, save for Expression and Func, but a Func can be implicitly cast to an Expression.
Fun times 
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OriginalGriff wrote: just pick a name and assign a value. So if you misspell it ... that's a new variable
but how do you misspell "i"
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'j'? 'u', 'o', 'k'? All easy to do, especially on a "soft keyboard". 
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Use Cryllic. Word doesn't match the second as 'sit':
sit
sіt
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There is also the "Extra quote character": ''' which looks just like the ones around it, but will not compile in other peoples code - not that you would replace any, I'm sure ...
Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640
Never throw anything away, Griff
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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lopatir wrote: but how do you misspell "i"
Right. That cost me a couple days of work, in the days when Fortran, as well as hardcopy code, were still around. (Yes I know there are languages called Fortran today, but they look completely different!). The loop went trhough once (as Fortran always does), but wouldn't repeat. I didn't discover the problem until I sat down with a printout of the disassebled binary code. Fortunately, the disassembler made use of the symbol defintions in the debug info, and fortunately, the printer (as opposed to the screen) used serif fonts. Then I could distinguish an "l" from an "I", so a conditional jump out of the loop used a diferent variable from the intended one.
There are several such "false friends". I should have known, because in my student days, one of my friends who was a TA in the elementary Fortran programming class caused and "incident": The professor insisted on Norwegian variable names, so instead of "QUEUE" the variable should be named "KØ". "Ø" isn't recognized in Fortran, but ø is commonly transcribed to English as oe, which makes it "K0E". Because we have Ø as a letter, we do not slash zeroes here. Depending on the typeface, KOE and K0E may look almost perfectly identical. They did on our screens. When Jon discovered, he exclaimed loudly so that everybody around could hear hear it to the very good-looking, 18 year old female freshman: "Look, here you are not saying k-oh-e, you are saying k-null-e!" Zero is "null" in Norwegian and "knulle" means f**k... Jon didn't realize was he was "suggesting" until the word had been pronounced, and he got so ashamed that he wanted to flee away. But the girl did accept his excuses.
Actually, it doesn't take national characters, like ø, to confuse 0 and O - even in English-speaking environments, non-slashed zeroes are common. Some typeface do not distinguish much between 1 and l either - I have seen troubles caused by that pair as well.
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Fortran: screen?? You were doing it wrong. If you'd had the punch card deck you'd have spotted the mistake straight away...
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