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This is insane. I guess I need to find a new career, maybe one in which
people start standing up for themselves.
I didnt go to 4 years of college just to make 20K a year!!!
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When this survey started I was in the top 4%, now I’m finding my self in the top 7%, just like in my real job, all of the new hires come in brown nosing the boss and get paid more then me
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If the vast majority of you people are willing to accept the lame sum of 0 to 20K per annum then no wonder the rest of us normal americans are finding it hard to get a raise! If you do not have any, strap on a pair of nuts and demand a real salary!
Thanks to the majority of the clowns who responded to this survey I am starving!
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They are probably in India or some such which is why work keeps getting outsourced. Some non-techinical accountant says "Hay, we could save a bunch if we outsource". Then they end up spending twice as much in communications, rework, misunderstanding ...
Not to say that programmers in India suck. I'm sure they have as many sorry programers as we do. Just that oversees projects usually fail due to logistical issues.
E=mc2 -> BOOM
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Albert Einstien wrote: Just that oversees projects usually fail due to logistical issues.
Not all of them fail - some of them are pretty successful. Which is why companies like Microsoft have setup offices in India - in fact, I believe outside of the US, Microsoft's largest offices are in India. Other big players like IBM, HP, Oracle etc. all have offices in India - that actually works compared to sending work to a 3rd party company!
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That may be so but you have to have an office in India, which unless your Microsoft, IBM, HP, Oracle or a company of simaler size, you still run into the logistical issue. Companies of that size have offices most everywhere anyway as they are truely global companies. An International company (a firm with a main office here that does business oversees) will still have issues outsourceing.
E=mc2 -> BOOM
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Almost every country has offices with the 'big players'.
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Between starving to death with a 0-income and getting a sub-20K pay, most 3rd worlders choose the sub-20K pay - which is a good choice. But once they work for a couple of years, they continue working on sub-20K pays - which I believe is not such a smart decision.
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I am not sure that the code behind the poll is up to it, but it would be nice to select the country then the salary, given the country currency.
For instance, I could compare my Canadian income and see how I am doing compared to my peers.
To simplify things a little, countries using euro currency could be grouped together.
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You may have some people here who don't have a life and work hourly night and day, thus some of the BIG numbers.
Tony Teveris
Gerber Scientific Products
Senior Software Engineer
Phone: 860 648 8151
Fax: 860 648 8214
83 Gerber Road West
South Windsor, CT 06074
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I would have to agree with you. When I was hourly I made a bit more than my salary counterparts. Where I live the max for a developer is around 70k, however, the same job in a higher cost of living section of the country can fetch upwards of 100k. So don't forget about the area in which these people live.
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My annual income depends on how hard i feel like working on projects i don't particulary like to do. As a freelancer i always try to at least make enough for rent, food, and Tuition but beyond that it's just a matter of if I feel like working on someone elses project, or my own. Most of the time it comes down to someone elses 
On a side note, mr BOB needs to consider where he is currently at. This is not a forum with other 12 and 13 year olds. The intention of these boards is to provide a mutual ground for sharing knowledge on computer programming, and it would not be unbecoming of you to try and show a little bit of professionalism. The way you present yourself, even to people on the internet who you will likely never meet, or have to deal with is important.
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Hello,
StevenpWalsh wrote: On a side note, mr BOB needs to consider where he is currently at.
I was wondering, which mister BOB are you referring to?
Behind every great black man...
... is the police. - Conspiracy brother
Blog[^]
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Sorry this was meant to be a reply, not a new thread. It was in response to a few immature remarks by the user 12BOB13 a few threads down.
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StevenpWalsh wrote: Sorry this was meant to be a reply, not a new thread. It was in response to a few immature remarks by the user 12BOB13 a few threads down.
I tend to ignore such remarks. I already wasted too much time feeding the trolls...
Behind every great black man...
... is the police. - Conspiracy brother
Blog[^]
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I've read all the comments in here. Anyone who thinks this survey is valid is smoking crack.
At the VERY least, country should be identified, but to be accurate, the geographical regions (down to no more than 200 sq miles) should be identified.
The sub-title of this survery:
'Here's a chance to compare what your making with those of your compatriots. Time to ask the boss for a raise?'
What?!!! So the purpose of this survey is for all the developers that work in the United States (and a few other countries) are supposed to tell their boss that we make too much money!
Whatever. I love codeproject but this survey is rediculous.
- Paul Brower
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Paul Brower wrote: So the purpose of this survey is for all the developers that work in the United States (and a few other countries) are supposed to tell their boss that we make too much money!
The bosses now have a chance to realize that they can get economically more viable options if they think beyond their borders 
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I agree that this servey isn't very scientific, not like these serveys are anyway, but the pay depends so much on qualifications and the exchange rate of your country's currency...
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Or are some of them just selecting that option for fun? It is easy to click the over $200,000 radio button, regardless of your salary.
Pumk1nh3ad illustrates that Intelligent Design oft goes awry. - Ed Gadziemski
You did'nt get it. I over estimated you. - Josh Gray
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By the same token, maybe some people clicked the 20K or less because they are feel guilty? <g>
In general, it survey results follows the general industry rates. The old rule is that only 1% of the programmers out there are any good anyway, and they are well paid. I wouldn't call them just programmers, but software or system engineers, team leaders and/or project managers with most likely a college education, 10+ years of broad experience. These guys a common attribute: they know how to solve problems and they help bring in money into the company. They are not just consuming money.
I'm not surprise to see such a low pay (20K) for the majority. This serves to confirm there are a lot of people out there that a self taught with no formal training. They might have a computer related job, support maybe, but not in any significant programming or engineerng project which puts you more in the middle tier.
What isn't shown is the international segments. That could also explain a higher 20K rate.
Hector Santos, CTO
Santronics Software, Inc.
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1% only? Maybe in your area! I've seen many many good programmers (and other IT "experts") that were very good. Regardless, I don't know anyone working in "the industry" that makes under 50k at the very least (in Canada).
I think you're 100% wrong with your claims of "99% of programmers sucks, so they deserve to be in the 0-20k bracket". It doesn't confirm ANYTHING about education either. Ever heard of outsourcing? Right! Pretty much everyone in that category will be in that 0-20k bracket. That's the only logical explanation (that and perhaps students learning programming).
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My question is: is this survey meant only for US citizens ?
If not, what is the point in comparing salaries of persons in different countries ?
I am employed in India and getting a very decent and high salary. But still less than $20000 p.a. I may be having a better life standard than an average American software developer. It is wrong to compare my salary with that of an average American software developer, without taking into consideration the conversion rates between dollar and Indian rupee as well as the relative purchasing powers of dollar and Indian rupee.
May I know what this survey result is going to serve ?
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