|
How is the British National Health Service the same thing as mandatory insurance coverage (Obama Care)? The mandatory insurance coverage does not even guarantee medical treatment, and many cannot afford it, never mind the premiums. Not everyone is subsidized.
Saying someone lacks in intelligence for complaining about a system that has adversely affected as many people as it helps is very mean spirited. Silencing the opposition is the thing of dictatorships, not democracy.
|
|
|
|
|
Were you under the impression that the National Health Service is free?
It costs a lot of money, which is paid through an ad hoc tax (called National Insurance payments) and from other taxation.
It is by no means cheap, but everyone contributes, so that our fellow Britons can receive the same health care that we would wish to receive if we were to fall ill.
It. Costs. Money.
I don't think I've ever heard anyone put the arguments that I've heard coming from America (e.g. your "a system that has adversely affected as many people as it helps").
Perhaps that is because we value the wellbeing of our compatriots and our children more than we value money.
And yes, we think that getting those value priorities wrong is both unintelligent and uncivilised.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
Mark_Wallace wrote: It is by no means cheap, but everyone contributes, so that our fellow Britons
can receive the same health care that we would wish to receive if we were to
fall ill.
But that is not what we have... we have people who are exempt! Unions, politicians, government staffers, etc.
If you are above the subsidy level (income wise) you get no help, never mind what your economic situation is (paying for care for other dependents - children, elderly, handicapped).
Having insurance coverage, just so you don't pay a tax (which gets you no coverage) does not mean you can even afford the deductible were you to go to the doctor or hospital... in many cases the deductible is outright ridiculous. You still face a medical bankruptcy.
There are a lot of negative points to the law. Calling anyone unintelligent or uncivilized for talking seriously about those points is ludicrous.
And apparently you are not even affected by the law, and have no first hand experience... but feel compelled to degrade to name calling when supporting your arguments. 
|
|
|
|
|
It seems to me that he is saying that the idea of US healthcare is ludicrous to the mind of a Brit, whether this is Obama's version or that of his opposition
to some degree I agree, it surprises me that the US will accept that the police force is in theory there to provide a service to all yet medical care is not
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start
Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
|
|
|
|
|
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson wrote: It seems to me that he is saying that the idea of US healthcare is ludicrous to
the mind of a Brit, whether this is Obama's version or that of his opposition
That is fair, both sides are off base (imo). The real problem is the insurance markets and that is what Obamacare has forced us to use! The exact opposite of a healthcare solution. It exacerbated the problem.
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson wrote: to some degree I agree, it surprises me that the US will accept that the police
force is in theory there to provide a service to all yet medical care is not
That is a fair opinion too... but the police force has always been (as far as I know) a government provided service for the people. Medical care has always been a private industry. Those are two very different scopes. However, the American government HAS always provided medical service, even before Obamacare. There is medicaid and medicare (for the poor and/or elderly/sickly). Additionally, the ER was not allowed to turn away people in life threatening situations. We effectively had guaranteed care... paid for by the taxpayer. People could say those systems are broken... but instead of fixing them... they made us buy insurance! 
P.S. Thank you for the lack of insulting and name calling Americans for debating a piece of legislation. I'm not saying it is wrong to have an opinion (either for or against) but wrong to insult those who feel differently. 
|
|
|
|
|
Kindly stick to truths; you don't have to sell anything to me, so don't recite Interweb BS.
This is the list of exemptions:
- You aren’t required to file a tax return because your income is too low
- Your lack of insurance coverage was for only three months or less
- The lowest-price health care coverage amounts to more than 8% of your income
- You are part of a Native American tribe
- You are in the U.S. illegally
- You are a member of a health care sharing ministry
- Your religion objects to insurance
- You are incarcerated
- You qualify for a hardship exemption
That's pretty much the same as in the UK (except that being a Native American is no excuse, you're exempt if you're in the U.S. legally or illegally, and religion is irrelevant).
Everyone pays. Everyone gets treatment.
No-one is more important than anyone else, when it comes to National Insurance.
No-one has the right to say "I'm not paying for other people to receive treatment".
And, in fact, no-one does say it, because it's other people who will pay for any treatment you or your family might need.
You think that talking only about money when children are ill is civilised and intelligent?
Good luck with that attitude to life.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
You are jumping to a lot of conclusions. Not everyone who disagrees with that law turns their back on folks needing help, kids or otherwise.
And you have completely ignored my points about the legislatures and unions being exempt... why do they get special status? You are arguing for an ideal, which is not actuality.
|
|
|
|
|
I've watched the development of this. All the problems with it are a result of having to pander to various self-absorbed "interested parties".
If you genuinely believe that your country will profit from healthcare being available only to the rich, then by all means exercise your right to free speech and protest.
But if you only want to bitch about the cost, or about imperfections that can be dealt with once it's running: keep it to yourself, because otherwise you are as much a part of the problem as the greedy, self-interested parties whose propaganda resulted in so many people not paying the tax.
The only way to go is:
Step 1: Get the tax paid.
Step 2: Get sick people treated.
Step 3: Sort out any problems and inequities.
Children and the poor dying from easily curable diseases may be inevitable in the third world, but it's absolutely unacceptable in our world.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
Mark_Wallace wrote: Children and the poor dying from easily curable diseases may be inevitable in the third world, but it's absolutely unacceptable in our world.
In what world do you live?
The poor dying from easily curable diseases is not inevitable and absolutely unacceptable regardless of where you are living in the world.
Once you lose your pride the rest is easy.
In the end, only three things matter: how much you loved, how gently you lived, and how gracefully you let go of things not meant for you. – Buddha
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
|
|
|
|
|
I know where I'd shove it if I were offered one.
I wouldn't take it out of the 100-unit box, either.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
Mark_Wallace wrote: I know where I'd shove it if I were offered one.
I think implanting it into your hand would be much more pleasant than where you are implying. However, to each his own. 
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
|
|
|
|
|
they will stick an apple logo on it and they will be queuing round the block to get them
(even if they have them inserted where you suggest)
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start
Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
|
|
|
|
|
Yeah, but by the time they get to iRFID 6, it's be too big to fit in your hand and will bend when you sit down...
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
|
|
|
|
|
it wont stop them nothing will stop them
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start
Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
|
|
|
|
|
And the aerial will be blocked if you twist your bum just so...
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
newton.saber wrote: next they'll be replacing your head with a robotic one so they can be sure you follow orders
They don't need to do that ?they've? been genetically producing a generation of Walmart sheep that will do anything the government wants.
New version: WinHeist Version 2.1.0
My goal in life is to have a psychiatric disorder named after me.
I'm currently unsupervised, I know it freaks me out too but the possibilities are endless.
|
|
|
|
|
Mike Hankey wrote: genetically producing a generation of Walmart sheep that will do anything
Baaa, baaaa... I hear and OBuy, master... Which products best do your bidding, master? I hear and obey. baaaa... 
|
|
|
|
|
Marys[^] looking for you. 
New version: WinHeist Version 2.1.0
My goal in life is to have a psychiatric disorder named after me.
I'm currently unsupervised, I know it freaks me out too but the possibilities are endless.
|
|
|
|
|
So what happens when you change jobs? Does your exit interview take place in a surgery ward? Or do they leave it in, you know, just so you can be tracked by the government in case?
|
|
|
|
|
what makes you think you can leave?
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start
Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You can check out any time you want...
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
|
|
|
|
|
...but you can never leave!
What do you get when you cross a joke with a rhetorical question?
---
The metaphorical solid rear-end expulsions have impacted the metaphorical motorized bladed rotating air movement mechanism.
---
Do questions with multiple question marks annoy you???
|
|
|
|
|
Vark111 wrote: So what happens when you change jobs?
If you have a preexisting condition your new health insurance policy does not cover it for the first six months.
The choice you have is to retain your previous policy, paying 100% of the premium, in addition to your new insurance policy or going without medical intervention for the preexisting condition for six months.
This is not an option for low wage earners because paying for an insurance policy without employer contribution, in addition to your new policy, is out of the price range for all but high income people.
In my opinion that is the major difference between universal health care and mandatory insurance to purchase medical care in a private marketplace.
Considering that preexisting conditions (cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc.) are often life threatening this is not a viable solution.
Universal health care insures - pun intended - everyone gets health care. Mandatory insurance only insures - again pun intended - that the insurance companies prosper.
Once you lose your pride the rest is easy.
In the end, only three things matter: how much you loved, how gently you lived, and how gracefully you let go of things not meant for you. – Buddha
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
modified 3-Mar-15 22:33pm.
|
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
