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Nelek wrote: I am someone that usually polarize people too, some love me, some hate me, most both depending on how is my day going
Welcome to the cool club.
Nelek wrote: Not sure if crazy is the correct word... PITA would be more accurate
Nelek wrote: There are a lot of crazy people that will remain considered crazy after their time.
Touché
Nelek wrote: I would change the "weak" with "wrong", there are strong people that can't handle it either.
Well in particular, I mean strong minded... which isn't always being stubborn. Totally agree there are a lot of stubborn people that may come of as such, but I consider them closed off and hardly any better.
Nelek wrote: One of my favourite contras... "Oh, perfect! Insults... the last resource when simple minds run out of arguments. If at least they were original..." that drives them nuts
I ain't gonna lie, I've done that too. You're right in that it's a cop-opt. After decades of arguing though... I kinda like it.
Nelek wrote: It is not usual to see you making a compliment, and even more scarce to get it personally.
Totally agree there. I do have a negative bias which stems from my contrarian core philosophy. And please take this the right way, but there's also the fact that deep down I don't have much respect for peeps online that hide behind fake screen names and profiles. I did that too as a kid. I grew up. So, for sure, when it comes to CP I already know the caliber of people I'm dealing with.
But yeah, I feel ya. I have worked on giving out compliments in real life. So, I am better at it. Just ya know... probably never gonna happen with CP.
Jeremy Falcon
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: Well in particular, I mean strong minded... which isn't always being stubborn. Totally agree there are a lot of stubborn people that may come of as such, but I consider them closed off and hardly any better.
Fair enough
Jeremy Falcon wrote: You're right in that it's a cop-opt
 cop-opt? Never saw this expression before...
Jeremy Falcon wrote: And please take this the right way, but there's also the fact that deep down I don't have much respect for peeps online that hide behind fake screen names and profiles. I did that too as a kid. I grew up.
I can understand it, but I have been using this Nick since the very beginning in most of the places I have been online in my life (even in games), so the ones I met 25 years ago (and still remember it) would be able to recognise me as well...
Fvck... I just realized I have used "25 years ago", referring to me in adult age... damn it
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Nelek wrote: cop-opt?
Have no idea how that phrase came to be... but it means to avoid doing something. Taking the easy way. Not doing it, etc.
Nelek wrote: Fvck... I just realized I have used "25 years ago", referring to me in adult age... damn it
Welcome to the club brother. On the upside we get to start taking Bingo seriously soon.
Jeremy Falcon
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trønderen wrote: I don't know the legal status of the pocket edition
Your concern is probably valid.
Not so much as to whether a native born US citizen can buy them but rather whether an immigrant or even visitor who either brings them in a bag or attempts to have them shipped from another country might go through.
Even if finally deemed legal the legal costs for defending oneself could be crippling.
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Not so amusing story about books
When I departed the U.S. Army in 1967 I took a job with a very reputable pharmaceutical company CIBA
One of our promotional concepts was to distribute to Medical Schools and Teaching Hospitals books by
Frank Netter.
Frank H. Netter - Wikipedia[^]
In High School for 4 years I had a Library Science Class with a wonderful teacher.
So when I obtained a complete set of Netter Atlas's I decided to donate these to my High School Library
The same teacher was still there and was so excited she called the Biology teacher to come have a look.
Please bear in mind these lithographs are anatomically correct.
Biology teacher said "I think we need to have these approved before students can see them"
Now I know why I did not learn any useful Biology !
YES that was 1970 IMHO we have lost our way when we censor books
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trønderen wrote: I do not consider a ban on public smoking a "moral" law, but a way to protect myself (and others) from harm.
While I do believe in freedom, I gotta agree with this too. If it were victimless that would be one thing... it's not though.
Jeremy Falcon
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No, those viewpoints are not mutually exclusive.
If you do it such that if affects no-one else, you're not a member of society.
Smoking affects my Insurance policy/Tax, so it isn't just about secondary smoking.
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Yes, some insurance companies have surcharge (significant one) for smokers. I know because I had a friend in my previous company that smokes (hardly anybody still smokes in the US). I wonder in this case why they don't have the same penalty for fat people, or alcoholics? Because they vastly outnumber the smokers and are bigger burden for the health system.
Advertise here – minimum three posts per day are guaranteed.
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Single Step Debugger wrote: (hardly anybody still smokes in the US)
I question that statement.
Quick look suggests it is still 10%. And that is 'cigarettes'.
Looks like it goes up to 20% when one includes vaping with nicotine.
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10% sound about right, but it looks like you've never been to Europe. Or outside the US. People smoke! I mean like...half of them.
Advertise here – minimum three posts per day are guaranteed.
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Rob Philpott wrote: f you want to smoke, that's your business and not for others to tell you whether you can or can't (as long as you do it such that if affects no-one else),
... provided you sign a waiver that you will not be treated in any hospital paid by my tax dollars by any doctor affiliated with a public health system funded by me.
In general, I see it as a continuum between a society that has very few rules and provides very few services and a society with lots of rules but also lots of services. Different cultures sit/stood in different places going from the Old Testament where the 10 commandments were quite enough but, if something bad happened to you, you had only your immediate family to count on. Nowadays in complicated social-democratic countries with tons of rules there are also myriad support systems from social services to ambulances, police, coast guard and whatnot.
Unfortunately you cannot have one without the other: if you want to be free to do whatever you want, don't ask for public services to come help you when things go south. Looks like most people would rather have a social safety net and are willing to accept certain limitations in their lifestyle (like not smoking in public places). As most social compromises, this is a pendulum that might well swing the other way.
Mircea
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I mostly agree with view 1, but maybe view 2 is necessary for some people. E.g. my neighbour will smoke even when he's sick and I hear him nearly coughing his lungs out every day. I understand it's an addiction and maybe some people need to be forced to quit, for their own health.
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This is what smokers get to look forward too: Emphysema[^].
As a lifetime asthmatic, I can tell you, from experience, that not being able to breathe is no fun at all. So my choice is not to breathe second hand smoke. That is my personal right. I am not interested in emphysema on top of my asthma.
Graeme
"I fear not the man who has practiced ten thousand kicks one time, but I fear the man that has practiced one kick ten thousand times!" - Bruce Lee
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There's bad habits ... and then there are enablers of bad habits; creating addictions.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
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Get reminded of this person.
He outlived all the doctors who advised him to quit smoking.
Looks like one in a billion possibility, though.
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 Yeah, you have to love the world's oldest man spends his days 'eating and smoking'!
Regards,
Rob Philpott.
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My wife is allergic to cigarette and cigar smoke. She does her best to avoid smokers as a result and we won't go places where we have reason to believe there will be smokers, but when someone lights up in areas that are posted as no smoking they are now impacting her health.
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Rob Philpott wrote: They were also free to use physical violence in the case of bad behaviour
Corporal punishment in schools is still legal in the United States. Especially in private schools.
United Kingdom fully outlawed it in 1997.
Rob Philpott wrote: like the teachers who used to smoke in my classrooms
Sex also should not be banned. But that shouldn't be happening in the classroom either.
Rob Philpott wrote: The problem is, to my mind, these mutually exclusive ideas about smoking are both valid and worth defending to the hilt,
Where I am night clubs
1. Allow drinking alcohol.
2. Don't allow marijuana.
3. Don't allow tobacco.
4. Don't allow sex.
5. Don't allow heroin.
6. Don't allow one to beat the wife.
Of those 4 out of the 6 are allowed when one is at home.
Might note that in the past the last was at least tolerated at home.
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If people want to smoke and they do it out of harms way to others, that is fine with me.
On the other hand, smokers should not be covered by insurance for any illness that is a result of their smoking, which such costs are passed on to non-smokers such as myself.
Smoking is a deadly habit in which the carcinogens attack every organ in the body. Back in the days when I grew up in the 1950s and 1960s, smoking was far more prevalent but not as dangerous since it wasn't until a little later when cigarette companies began filling their cigarettes with all sorts of chemicals making them far more addictive and dangerous to one's health. This is not to say that smoking wasn't dangerous but back then many men died more from heart attacks from eating too much meat and drinking than cancer.
One would think that an intelligent society would ban such substances as tobacco use.
But most societies on Earth have yet to reach a level of intelligence where people do not need to indulge in such dangerous habits...
Steve Naidamast
Sr. Software Engineer
Black Falcon Software, Inc.
blackfalconsoftware@outlook.com
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My first experiment with smoking was cough cough not so smooth
A pack of Cigarettes was 0.65 cents and a candy bar was 0.05 cents to 0.10 cents
either way I could have 6 to 10 candy bars it was a no brainier.
Fast forward to my job working for a pharmaceutical company CIBA
The company had this bright idea each rep should spend a day with a physician.
The fellow I choose said meet me at the hospital at 6 AM Great
running late breakfast was a doughnut and glass of milk.
My Physician explained we were going to observe a autopsy on a patient who had died last night
did I have any issues NOPE.
This patient had been a smoker and a coal miner YEP Black Lung
When they removed the one lung it was the size of a small child's hand
and the other lung was intact and much larger.
Besides almost loosing my breakfast I knew I was never going to work in a coal mine
and smoking was never ever going to be a part of my life
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I saw all that and more after I graduated high school in 1968 and attended a summer seminar in cancer research...
Steve Naidamast
Sr. Software Engineer
Black Falcon Software, Inc.
blackfalconsoftware@outlook.com
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There is a problem between these 1 and 2: "(as long as you do it such that if affects no-one else)". Many smokers do not realize how their smoke affects others.
1. I used to work in an office outside of which was a smoking area. The smoke was drawn in through two sets of doors then into my office, or somehow came in through my closed window or gaps in the outside brickwork.
2. Smoking causes illness, increasing the insurance premiums for all of us to treat those expensive to treat illnesses.
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Personal responsibility, the "Why can't I do what I want if I don't harm anyone" argument was never a thing. The personal responsibility argument is all about doing something destructive, self-destructive or foolish. No one ever deployed the personal responsibility argument in favor of doing something positive. No one ever said "Why can't I cure cancer as long as I don't harm anyone. This asymmetry ought to be the first clue that the argument is fallacious.
The personal responsibility argument is all about defining "harm" narrowly to avoid inconvenient costs. The smoker who says he isn't hurting anyone doesn't count the harm to himself, doesn't consider the negative health effects of his smoke-cloud, doesn't think of his dependents left alone when he dies.
If you think human beings are lonely apex predators, like lions, then it's understandable why you'd want to leave the weakest lions to choke to death on their smoke. But many people regard genus homo as a social animal. We are, by this definition, our brothers' keepers. Society has an interest in helping a smoker to quit for the same reason they would stop a depressed person from killing themselves or stop a drug addict from shooting up. We're just better when we don't throw lives away. Plus there are those externalized costs of smoking (or suicide, or drug use) which is why we are better when lives are preserved.
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I have to say I thought todays answer was six letters - anyone agree ?
In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity. - Hunter S Thompson - RIP
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It looks odd, but it's right at 5.
You can use 6, but frankly that looks even odder!
"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
"Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt
AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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