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At Symantec there truly were godlike programmers there - one of them was the guy who wrote the first version of EMM386. So in their presence I was like Wayne Campbell, "I'm not worthy! I'm not worthy!" 
--Mike--
The Internet is a place where absolutely nothing happens.
-- Strong Bad
1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click!
My really out-of-date homepage
Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
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Did you enjoy working with a person like that?
I think that I would like to have that opportunity someday.
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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I didn't actually work with him, however we did do code reviews a couple of times (when I had to add some NEC PC-98 related hacks into his stuff) and he was a supremely nice guy.
--Mike--
The Internet is a place where absolutely nothing happens.
-- Strong Bad
1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click!
My really out-of-date homepage
Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
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who wrote the first version of EMM386
The DR DOS version, or the MS DOS version? The DR DOS version rocked, the MS DOS version sucked. Just sitting there, the MS DOS version slowed the machine down so much we couldn't use unbuffered 8250 serial I/O chips at 38400 bps. And the machine we were testing on was FASTER than the DR DOS machine. Of course, we discovered this a couple days before a major demo, and had to scramble to use the new 16550 chips (which had bugs in them too!)
Ah, the good 'ol days.
Marc
Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"
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Marc Clifton wrote:
The DR DOS version, or the MS DOS version?
Not sure (I didn't get into PCs until 1995). Whichever one was made by Quarterdeck.
--Mike--
The Internet is a place where absolutely nothing happens.
-- Strong Bad
1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click!
My really out-of-date homepage
Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
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That would be the DR DOS version then! Cool!
Marc
Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"
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"cow-orkers". Dilbert fan, I presume? 
You can pick your friends, and you can pick your nose, but you can't pick your friend's nose.
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Michael Dunn wrote:
At Symantec there truly were godlike programmers there - one of them was the guy who wrote the first version of EMM386. So in their presence I was like Wayne Campbell, "I'm not worthy! I'm not worthy!"
That must have been an nice environment to work in (possibly?), interesting none the less. Were they great simply through experience and/or was there extensive educations (Masters, PhD's, etc.) invlolved?
Nick Parker
The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything. - Theodore Roosevelt
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Nick Parker wrote:
That must have been an nice environment to work in (possibly?)
It really depended on the people. When I first started working there as a QA engineer there was a real divide between QA and dev. I had to learn on my own back then, since the other folks on the QA team were as green as me.
Once I got a job in dev, I always made sure to go talk to the QA guys from time to time (it helped that by that time, the teams weren't physically separated, my cube was in an area with lots of QA guys) to try and prevent that divide from building back up.
For a while we had a rec room with a pool table, and I met more guys there than during normal work. The NU and NAV teams didn't really mingle that much, and forget about the Mac guys, they were off in their own world. 
Nick Parker wrote:
Were they great simply through experience and/or was there extensive educations (Masters, PhD's, etc.) invlolved?
Experience, definitely. I don't recall any of the coders having more than an undergrad degree, and another guy who was hired right after me had just finished high school (his programming experience was that good).
--Mike--
The Internet is a place where absolutely nothing happens.
-- Strong Bad
1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click!
My really out-of-date homepage
Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
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Why is it you consider yourself way above average? What ability or skill do you have that makes you way above average? And what do you consider average? Just curious.
Todd Smith
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My ability to Anticipate, Design, Innovate, Plan, and Reuse code compared to the other developers.
Anyone can learn how to program, can you learn how to program effectively?
Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for a day
Light a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life!
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The ability to think.
Marc
Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"
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Marc Clifton wrote:
The ability to think.
I KNEW I forgot something.
-Jack
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The ability to code PLUS the ability to design!
Anybody can put a bunch of language statements together; there are significantly fewer, perhaps 5% of the development community, that truly understand design principles along with the physics involved in systems.
I always point new team members to the "Eight Fallacies of Distributed Computing", it used to be seven a while back.
http://java.sun.com/people/jag/Fallacies.
Shawn C
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I'm persistent and anal-retentive.
 
Software Zen: delete this;
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when you are good,
you know you are good! 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Memory leaks is the price we pay \0
01234567890123456789012345678901234
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In general I rate myself about average, yet I excel in many areas and am really poor in others. If you keep to my skill set then I would rat emyself quite highly, but on average.... those statistics let me down* 
*Lies, damn lies and statistics!
Roger Allen
Sonork 100.10016
WHats brown and sticky?
A stick or some smelly stuff!
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Roger Allen wrote:
yet I excel in many areas and am really poor in others.
Just coding in C++ has become too big an area for one person alone to claim they have mastered. I'm surprised how much new stuff I am continually learning.
I think you have to rank yourself on other criteria rather than knowledge.
Regardz
Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I'm guessing the concept of a 2 hour movie showing two guys eating a meal and talking struck them as 'foreign'
Rob Manderson wrote:
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... we are only 3 developers, one is DBA, so actually 2 programmers, so where is the average? 
Philip Patrick
Web-site: www.stpworks.com
"Two beer or not two beer?" Shakesbeer
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You are capable of visiting CP so you are above average.
What about the other programmer, does he go wow where did you learn that. (And it was from a CP article)
Even if he/she does know where CP is at least you had the initiative to post a question about it.
Regardz
Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I'm guessing the concept of a 2 hour movie showing two guys eating a meal and talking struck them as 'foreign'
Rob Manderson wrote:
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lol 
well, he knows what CP is, though not visiting it too much. And yes, when I bring something new, he says: "Wow, that's good". Of course I'm not telling him that this is from CP
Philip Patrick
Web-site: www.stpworks.com
"Two beer or not two beer?" Shakesbeer
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Philip Patrick wrote:
Of course I'm not telling him that this is from CP
That's good form mate!!
Soon you'll be a way above average programmer.
Regardz
Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I'm guessing the concept of a 2 hour movie showing two guys eating a meal and talking struck them as 'foreign'
Rob Manderson wrote:
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I use VC, VB, ASP, SQL, VBScript, XML.. etc.
It all depends on the job at hand.. If the purpose is to knock something together in 30minutes, I'll grab VB, if I'm putting together a quick webpage, it'll be HTML and VBScript.
If I'm doing something for Higher performance/lower level api stuff VC is where I go..
If the webpages are for others to look after, then it will be XML/XSL with ASP joining them together..
Please let me know if I'm doing it wrong, becuase at this point, it seems to be ok...
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It's not VB itself, it's the thought that knowing VB makes you a programmer.
It's a royal pain to watch a sex drugs and rock'n'roll design decay into an aids crack and techno implementation [sighist] [Agile Programming] [doxygen]
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